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<blockquote data-quote="bloodtide" data-source="post: 8707181" data-attributes="member: 6684958">So this happen to me twice over two days.&nbsp; All the players acted like it was common.&nbsp; That everyone does it.&nbsp; But, I've never heard of it.&nbsp; Maybe it's some type of thing taken from a non D&amp;D game?&nbsp; How common is it?&nbsp; Do a lot of DMs do it?So it started with my second 5E Spelljammer game.&nbsp; They zoomed around wild space for three sesions and badly damaged their ship, but made it to an asteroid port.&nbsp; So for the fourth session they had a request: &quot;Can we do a bank heist, like the Oceans 11-12-13-movies?&quot;&nbsp; The plan is to rob a bank to pay for ship repairs.&nbsp; I say sure, and make a bank encounter.&nbsp; Session Four starts, and the players sort of scout the bank, enough to say &quot;ok, the bank is on bank street&quot;.&nbsp; Then they jump right into their first heist attempt with the non-plan of &quot;lets just all attack the bank like a crazy mob&quot;.&nbsp; It's a tough fight, and the players have thier character run away.&nbsp; So they hide in some star caves for a week, before coming back to the city.The second non-plan is the classic &quot;lets yell at each other and tell each other what to do mass attack&quot;.&nbsp; Much like the first they fail and run and hide.&nbsp; The third uses the not effective non-plan of &quot;Lets be all Lone Wolves and ignore each other, but attack at the same time&quot;&nbsp; This fails too, and they run.Then the players pause the game to state to me that they are ready to do the &quot;bank heist&quot; now.&nbsp; I tell them, ok, feel free to do so.&nbsp; And THIS is where it gets weird:&nbsp; The players want me as DM to both tell them how to do the bank heist AND just sit back and let it happen.&nbsp; So the adventure is random stuff happens, but the characters automatiacly, and with no effort on the players part, just &quot;do&quot; the bank heist.My response was a bit confused.&nbsp; I made the setting, the asteroid, city and the bank.&nbsp; As players, they are free to &quot;try anything&quot;.&nbsp; But I'm not going to tell them what to do or alter game reality so they just succeed at anything.&nbsp; I mentioned that they said they wanted an Ocean Elevens like game, and that movie is about some thieves with an amazing impossible plan to rob a vault.&nbsp; They agreed, sort of, but said it was too hard for them to do....that is why they wanted me to do it.--------------------The second one was in my new pick up group: They wanted a game for a couple weeks until school starts.&nbsp; And they had a request of &quot;they wanted to work for a dragon and then betray and kill the dragon&quot;.&nbsp; So, I said, sure.&nbsp; The first session they stop a group of dragonslayers and get mundane and magical dragon slaying items.....and ask to serve the dragon, showing how they stopped the dragonslayers.&nbsp; The dragon accepts them as minions.&nbsp; The second session they do all sorts of dragon jobs.&nbsp; We start the third session and they say they are ready to betray and kill the dragon.&nbsp; I say, ok, feel free to do that.&nbsp; And this is where they say they want me to set that up and tell them what to do and then just let it happen.&nbsp; I've never done anything like this.&nbsp; As a DM I make everything, but the players have to DO things they want in the game and FIGURE out everything themselves.&nbsp; But the players seemed to say it was really common.&nbsp; Is it?&nbsp; Are a lot of games like this?&nbsp; Is this something new?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="bloodtide, post: 8707181, member: 6684958"] So this happen to me twice over two days. All the players acted like it was common. That everyone does it. But, I've never heard of it. Maybe it's some type of thing taken from a non D&D game? How common is it? Do a lot of DMs do it? So it started with my second 5E Spelljammer game. They zoomed around wild space for three sesions and badly damaged their ship, but made it to an asteroid port. So for the fourth session they had a request: "Can we do a bank heist, like the Oceans 11-12-13-movies?" The plan is to rob a bank to pay for ship repairs. I say sure, and make a bank encounter. Session Four starts, and the players sort of scout the bank, enough to say "ok, the bank is on bank street". Then they jump right into their first heist attempt with the non-plan of "lets just all attack the bank like a crazy mob". It's a tough fight, and the players have thier character run away. So they hide in some star caves for a week, before coming back to the city. The second non-plan is the classic "lets yell at each other and tell each other what to do mass attack". Much like the first they fail and run and hide. The third uses the not effective non-plan of "Lets be all Lone Wolves and ignore each other, but attack at the same time" This fails too, and they run. Then the players pause the game to state to me that they are ready to do the "bank heist" now. I tell them, ok, feel free to do so. And THIS is where it gets weird: The players want me as DM to both tell them how to do the bank heist AND just sit back and let it happen. So the adventure is random stuff happens, but the characters automatiacly, and with no effort on the players part, just "do" the bank heist. My response was a bit confused. I made the setting, the asteroid, city and the bank. As players, they are free to "try anything". But I'm not going to tell them what to do or alter game reality so they just succeed at anything. I mentioned that they said they wanted an Ocean Elevens like game, and that movie is about some thieves with an amazing impossible plan to rob a vault. They agreed, sort of, but said it was too hard for them to do....that is why they wanted me to do it. -------------------- The second one was in my new pick up group: They wanted a game for a couple weeks until school starts. And they had a request of "they wanted to work for a dragon and then betray and kill the dragon". So, I said, sure. The first session they stop a group of dragonslayers and get mundane and magical dragon slaying items.....and ask to serve the dragon, showing how they stopped the dragonslayers. The dragon accepts them as minions. The second session they do all sorts of dragon jobs. We start the third session and they say they are ready to betray and kill the dragon. I say, ok, feel free to do that. And this is where they say they want me to set that up and tell them what to do and then just let it happen. I've never done anything like this. As a DM I make everything, but the players have to DO things they want in the game and FIGURE out everything themselves. But the players seemed to say it was really common. Is it? Are a lot of games like this? Is this something new? [/QUOTE]

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