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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Edena_of_Neith" data-source="post: 3577790" data-attributes="member: 2020">(rather militantly stated, for all responses below)  We can discuss that.  But that is a different discussion.  *We do not agree on this.*  In my opinion, one starts with the rules, and extrapolates from them to create those fantasy societies, cultures, and worlds, and this is the fundamental way in which things work in the game.  As in, the Player's Handbook and DMG are rulessets, and modules are rulessets, and boxed sets are rulessets, and the settings as we know them came from those, and our own home settings are inspired by books like the Player's Handbook ... for it gives us the skeletal rules to base the imagination on.  *Thus we disagree.*  But that is ok.  Let us agree to disagree.  As for it resulting in nonsense, that is so complicated an issue I think it would require a new thread.  Let me summarize by saying that I *partially* agree with you, on that *particular* point.  And let me also say, that nonsense is sometimes what we enjoy, which highlights the complexity of this subject.  I am debating from a rules point of view also, because it is pointless to debate from a house rule perspective ... house rules vary from group to group.  This debate began when I made a comment at 3rd Edition elves, and so it remains a debate about them ... within the RAW.  I happen to believe, to be blunt, that the Player's Handbook should have far more crunch and fluff on the non-human races.  I think it is a failure of the book that more is not there.  Should the imagination of player and DM be the primary factor?  Yes.  Should the PHB and perhaps DMG have more crunch and fluff as well?  Yes.  I do just that.  I wish the Player's Handbook would give me some support, however.  And/or the Dungeon Master's Guide.  And aren't they supposed to be there to give support?  Yes.  Now, let's put some rules, crunch and fluff, in the PHB and DMG to help stimulate the imagination.  There cannot be enough support from those books.  The DM and players need as much help and support as the books can offer.</blockquote>

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