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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mannahnin" data-source="post: 9519747" data-attributes="member: 7026594">Yes indeed.  Tim may have been unable to see it at the time, being stuck with a limited perspective only 2.5 years into this hobby, but epic heroes who can actually fight and humble or even kill gods are 100% in the mythic tradition that D&D draws from.  When you give a deity hit points, you are inherently enabling and implicitly encouraging folks to fight that deity.For most of my D&D career it's seemed obvious to me that deities are necessarily beyond stats.  But when I've played true epic levels, where the PCs are capable of miracles (like in 4E, for example), fighting archdemons like Orcus and deities like Vecna has been a logical and even obvious endgame.</blockquote>