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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DND_Reborn" data-source="post: 8524596" data-attributes="member: 6987520">This thread is going to the heart of something that really irks the Libra in me---too much sameyness between classes (not concerned about sameyness within classes--which I don't feel is there, but that is a different topic). There is too much overlap, to the point at one point we consolidated classes. Now, in an effort to restore the core 12 classes (sorry, folks, no Artificers here... <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> ), I am going to tackle some issues. You can contribute or not, this is also a place for me to just throw around ideas and see what sticks. Cheers.SAVING THROWS:Currently, if you look at the combinations of Strong/Weak saves, 2 of the 9 aren't being used at all. Now, that might not seem bad, but when you consider that Cleric, Paladin, and Warlock are all proficient in Wisdom and Charisma saves, it seems a bit too samey for me.For those who might not be aware of the distinction, strong saves are DEX, CON, and WIS because they are the most common saves in 5E. Leaving STR, INT, and CHA was "weak" saves because they are less common.RAW Saves:<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Barbarian and Fighter are CON, STR</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Sorcerer is CON, CHA</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Monk and Ranger are STR, DEX</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Rogue is DEX, INT</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Bard is DEX, CHA</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Druid and Wizard are WIS, INT</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Cleric, Paladin, and Warlock are WIS, CHA</li> </ul>and, leaving the unused combinations:<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">CON, INT is never used</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">STR, WIS is never used</li> </ul>Only three classes (Sorcerer, Rogue, and Bard) out of 12 have unique save combinations! Ugh! <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f621.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":mad:" title="Mad    :mad:"  data-smilie="4"data-shortname=":mad:" />So, like most of 5E, it is time for a tweak. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Revised Saves:<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Barbarians: STR, CON</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Bards: DEX, CHA</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Clerics: STR, WIS (replace CHA with STR)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Druid: CON, WIS (replace INT with CON)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Fighter: STR, DEX (replace CON with DEX)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Monk: DEX, WIS (replace STR with DEX)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Paladin: WIS, CHA</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Ranger: DEX, CON (replace STR with CON)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Rogue: DEX, INT</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Sorcerer: CON, INT (replaces CHA with INT)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Warlock: CON, CHA (replaces WIS with CON)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Wizard: WIS, INT</li> </ul>Now, every class has a unique save combination.Some Notes:1. Sorcerers are CON-based casters in our game, not CHA. Too many CHA-based casters IMO, another "samey" issue. So, that is why I felt it was fine to remove CHA from them.2. You'll notice Druids, Monks, and Rangers are all only strong saves. This is intentional as IMO Druids and Rangers are two of the less appealing classes due to their design in 5E. Monks eventually get all saves with Diamond Soul, so starting them with two strong saves didn't seem a stretch.That's it for now.</blockquote>

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