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The rapier in D&D
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<blockquote data-quote="Willie the Duck" data-source="post: 9758074" data-attributes="member: 6799660"><p>Now this was actually a thing in D&D. Back in 2nd edition where I mentioned they introduced rapiers and cutlasses (and stone/bone weapons and belaying pins and...) they had this issue. Players got ahold of The Complete Fighters guide and made up pirate and swashbuckler and savage kit characters and had a rollicking good time during character creation... and then their DMs put them right back into the same crawl-through-dungeons-and-fight-ghouls-and-ogres game they played with AD&D plate mail and longswords and the results were pretty grim. </p><p></p><p>Mind you, no worse than back in 1e when someone decided to use a horseman's flail or awl pike. AD&D wanted you to use longswords, lances, composite longbows, and two-handed swords (if your DM changes the magic item distribution), and then gave you two pages of other weapons to solidly ignore (oh, and maces and warhammers for clerics and for fighting skeletons).</p><p></p><p>Anyways, we've circled back at the point where you point out that setup A isn't designed for fighting dragons, and then everyone points out that setup B (longswords and plate) wasn't either. The correct gear for fighting dragons would be a vhegat* and nofflim*, and a whole lot of hoping and praying.</p><p><span style="font-size: 12px"><em>*weapons and armor that do not exist historically, that would have been developed in a world with real dragons.</em></span></p><p></p><p></p><p>I think Don is thinking of the AD&D-3e era, where the thing labelled longsword was the sword normally wielded in one hand and got little to no benefit* from adding a second hand -- and where there were specifically other swords for using two-handed and for using either one- or two-handed. <span style="font-size: 10px">*depending on overall rule structure, each edition slightly different.</span></p><p></p><p>You are correct that nowadays (5e/5e.24) the longsword is the one- or two-handed sword (with genuine reasons to wield in each format).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Willie the Duck, post: 9758074, member: 6799660"] Now this was actually a thing in D&D. Back in 2nd edition where I mentioned they introduced rapiers and cutlasses (and stone/bone weapons and belaying pins and...) they had this issue. Players got ahold of The Complete Fighters guide and made up pirate and swashbuckler and savage kit characters and had a rollicking good time during character creation... and then their DMs put them right back into the same crawl-through-dungeons-and-fight-ghouls-and-ogres game they played with AD&D plate mail and longswords and the results were pretty grim. Mind you, no worse than back in 1e when someone decided to use a horseman's flail or awl pike. AD&D wanted you to use longswords, lances, composite longbows, and two-handed swords (if your DM changes the magic item distribution), and then gave you two pages of other weapons to solidly ignore (oh, and maces and warhammers for clerics and for fighting skeletons). Anyways, we've circled back at the point where you point out that setup A isn't designed for fighting dragons, and then everyone points out that setup B (longswords and plate) wasn't either. The correct gear for fighting dragons would be a vhegat* and nofflim*, and a whole lot of hoping and praying. [SIZE=3][I]*weapons and armor that do not exist historically, that would have been developed in a world with real dragons.[/I][/SIZE] I think Don is thinking of the AD&D-3e era, where the thing labelled longsword was the sword normally wielded in one hand and got little to no benefit* from adding a second hand -- and where there were specifically other swords for using two-handed and for using either one- or two-handed. [SIZE=2]*depending on overall rule structure, each edition slightly different.[/SIZE] You are correct that nowadays (5e/5e.24) the longsword is the one- or two-handed sword (with genuine reasons to wield in each format). [/QUOTE]
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