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Message: <blockquote data-quote="gizmo33" data-source="post: 3477198" data-attributes="member: 30001">What ever that is that's called that is only useful for stuff that's already dead.  Once the Kyton is dead, then it would take some serious rules mangling to make the PCs afraid of it's sunder.  It's hard to identify an item on a creature that's trying to kill you with it.No they won't.  Most fights only last a few rounds.  And even if it lasted till infinity, they have no idea what the DM is rolling for his monsters attack rolls.  All they know is success or failure.What made you think you couldn't turn it?  You rolled your dice, you waved your holy symbol at the thing.  You got a result but the conclusion was that the attempt failed - not being successful is not the same thing as not being able.  What gave you the feeling that you knew enough about the situation to conclude that the DM made a mistake?  Ever hear of an Unhallow spell?  Can you imagine that stronger versions of the spell could exist?  Are you sure that you weren't standing in a pocket-dimension of Hell that affected your chances?The answer is that you don't know any of this unless I blab and tell you - or blab and tell you that it's not the case.  And my role as a DM is not to tell you a bunch of stuff that your characters wouldn't know, or rule out a bunch of paranoid thoughts that are hopefully filling your mind.  (And inevitably will if I just keep my trap shut and stick to telling you what your characters know.)They're not going to figure it out at some point unless you tell them as the DM, which is not your job - unless you want it to be, in which case you're just making the whole fear/suspense thing harder on yourself for no reason.You don't know what kind of chains a particular Kyton is carrying in my campaign - even if I tell you that no Kyton encountered previously has ever had magic chains (which I have no reason to tell you).  Even if you read, in a tome of dubious veracity, that Kyton's never carry magic chains.  Even if you cast some 1st level identify spell on the chains later to try to figure out what they were.  There are a thousand things that you can't even think of that might be going on in any situation, and as a DM I am under no obligation to tell you any of them.  Perhaps the chains are made of Gizmonium.  Seems like a geology or arcane knowledge (or appraisal) skill check could have told you that, but do you know what the DC is for the check?  If you fail the check, how will you know why you failed it?</blockquote>

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