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<blockquote data-quote="Remathilis" data-source="post: 4878246" data-attributes="member: 7635"><p>There is a fine line between "too many rules" and "not enough to make a good decision". </p><p></p><p>I've made the point about 4e's "rules as physics" approach before to others; why do you need 3-4 paragraphs of lava rules when "If you fall into lava, you die" sums it up much easier?</p><p></p><p>YET</p><p></p><p>Having detailed rules like that does allow DMs to abjuncate rule-oddities and corner cases better. For example, in 2e (in the dark days before DDMs) our party was fighting some orcs. One player, Bob, decided to engage the orcs far to our east to draw some out (being mostly squishy mages and thieves). One mage, standing farther back, declares on his initiative, he is "fireballing away from Bob."</p><p></p><p>Everyone had a different idea of what this statement meant. The Player thought the orcs were pincered and he was fireballing the center. The other players (Bob included) assumed he meant away from Bob but BEHIND the orcs to create a fireball-backdraft and scatter the orc rearguard. The DM, however, took it to mean everyone-who-was-not Bob was in the blast radius and we (all PCs but the mage and Bob) all got to make saves vs. spell, declaring the PC mage dead as a doornail if any of us survived the 7d6 fire blast.</p><p></p><p>A battlemat and mini's would have made such a critical misunderstanding impossible. A dozen pennies on a kitchen table might have made things clearer. </p><p></p><p>DM fiat only works well when the DM and the PCs are on the same page. Otherwise, you end up with terrible miscommunication and fireballed PCs. In the OPs example, perhaps the PCs believed they could gain surprise or unsettle said polearm weilder. Perhaps the PCs themselves have spears and people breakout the books to compare the lengh of a longspear vs. a bec-de-corbin. Perhaps the polearm weilders drop their polearms on impact (in round 1) and ready their short-sword, meaning the other side has no reason to gain initiative the second round. </p><p></p><p>The initiative system (even the broken, clunky one in AD&D) avoids such miscommunication by simply creating a arbitary system to handle all the nuiances. It wasn't perfect, but it could create moments where a crazed halfling with a dagger manages to slide past a polearm weilder before the latter can dig in an prepare his weapon.</p><p></p><p>So both too many and too few can be bad for game, IMHO.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Remathilis, post: 4878246, member: 7635"] There is a fine line between "too many rules" and "not enough to make a good decision". I've made the point about 4e's "rules as physics" approach before to others; why do you need 3-4 paragraphs of lava rules when "If you fall into lava, you die" sums it up much easier? YET Having detailed rules like that does allow DMs to abjuncate rule-oddities and corner cases better. For example, in 2e (in the dark days before DDMs) our party was fighting some orcs. One player, Bob, decided to engage the orcs far to our east to draw some out (being mostly squishy mages and thieves). One mage, standing farther back, declares on his initiative, he is "fireballing away from Bob." Everyone had a different idea of what this statement meant. The Player thought the orcs were pincered and he was fireballing the center. The other players (Bob included) assumed he meant away from Bob but BEHIND the orcs to create a fireball-backdraft and scatter the orc rearguard. The DM, however, took it to mean everyone-who-was-not Bob was in the blast radius and we (all PCs but the mage and Bob) all got to make saves vs. spell, declaring the PC mage dead as a doornail if any of us survived the 7d6 fire blast. A battlemat and mini's would have made such a critical misunderstanding impossible. A dozen pennies on a kitchen table might have made things clearer. DM fiat only works well when the DM and the PCs are on the same page. Otherwise, you end up with terrible miscommunication and fireballed PCs. In the OPs example, perhaps the PCs believed they could gain surprise or unsettle said polearm weilder. Perhaps the PCs themselves have spears and people breakout the books to compare the lengh of a longspear vs. a bec-de-corbin. Perhaps the polearm weilders drop their polearms on impact (in round 1) and ready their short-sword, meaning the other side has no reason to gain initiative the second round. The initiative system (even the broken, clunky one in AD&D) avoids such miscommunication by simply creating a arbitary system to handle all the nuiances. It wasn't perfect, but it could create moments where a crazed halfling with a dagger manages to slide past a polearm weilder before the latter can dig in an prepare his weapon. So both too many and too few can be bad for game, IMHO. [/QUOTE]
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