Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Enchanted Trinkets Complete--a hardcover book containing over 500 magic items for your D&D games!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Geek Talk & Media
The Ultimates: Homeland Security
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Mark_Aurel" data-source="post: 1607088" data-attributes="member: 1725"><p>I would respectfully disagree with that. Superman in Red Son is one of the first renditions of Superman in quite a while to capture an essential 'Superman-ness' that's usually missing from the monthlies. All the essential elements of the mythos is there, bar kryptonite, though in different and unique ways. </p><p></p><p>One of the more interesting aspects of the Superman character has always been his sociological impact. Superman has usually in the comics tended to adopt a passive stance with regards to humanity - he will fix big natural disasters and save lives, beat down alien invasions and such, but usually try to leave human social and technological development alone. There is a number of Superman stories in which he crosses that line, and those are remarkable for that reason alone. This issue, of Superman's sociological impact on humanity, was addressed by Elliot S. Maggin in the Silver Age, often considered the definitive Superman writer, when Superman was essentially put on trial by a cosmic tribunal of sorts. There have been many tales since in the same vein, such as the Armageddon 2001 Annual Elseworlds special from '91, where Superman becomes president of the US, or the more recent Superman: King of the World. Red Son is, in many ways, a more extended version of this kind of take on the character. The Superman movie (the first one, which is also by far the best) also had a very strong emphasis on this motif, with Jor-El's doctrine of non-interference in human history, which Superman violates in the end to save Lois Lane.</p><p></p><p>Superman's motives in Red Son are inherently good. The triggering event that caused him to embark on the path he took was in issue #1, when he met Lana, and saw that people were starving, due to the inefficiencies of the communist system. 'Tell your friends they don't have to be scared or hungry anymore, comrades. Superman is here to rescue them.' That's a fairly nice and representative slogan for Superman, wouldn't you say? That's what his mission in this book is. To better humanity's lot. </p><p></p><p>Now, a core conflict in Superman's character has always been the perfection - the 'super' - against the humanity. Superman isn't flawless. He makes mistakes. In Red Son, his mistake is that in saving humanity, he also makes humanity dependent upon him, taking away all freedom. The reprogrammed insurgents are both symbolic of this, and a form of foreshadowing. It is perhaps a somewhat blunt way of showing exactly where Superman is going too far.</p><p></p><p>In the end, the defining moment of the book is when Superman realizes his error. When all hope seems lost, all resistance crushed, the single sentence that Luthor composed shows him his mistake. It is then shown that he has been manipulated by Brainiac for years; that is also shown previously in the conversations in #3. In this part of the story, Superman's defeat of Brainiac is highly symbolic of his coming to the realization that controlling humanity the way he has done is wrong. His final, heroic act, is to save the Earth from the exploding Brainiac vessel. That is also a thoroughly Superman-esque act, in the non-interventionistic sense. Self-sacrificing, noble, and heroic.</p><p></p><p>Unlike a real dictator, Superman was never evil, vicious, or paranoid. He had certain ideals that he stood by. They were essentially the same as the regular Superman's, but colored by his communist background. That said, this story doesn't really have political undertones as much as it uses the political backdrop to tell a specific type of story, set in a familiar style. Any dictator is bad, no matter which 'system' or 'ideology' he confesses to. But sometimes, a dictator is better than the alternative.</p><p></p><p>There have been other Superman stories which went in similar ways - Kingdom Come is one example. Superman makes mistake upon mistake in how he handles things, and in the end, it all comes crashing down on him. Kingdom Come has a lot of similarities to Red Son in that regard, except that there, Superman isn't alone. Kingdom Come had other themes too, such as the very 90ish conflict between 'humanity and superhumanity.'</p><p></p><p>Red Son is a brilliant take on Superman, because it addresses not just most of the famous elements of the Superman mythology, and some of the DCU, but because of the way Superman is portrayed. As ever, he wants to help people - but he makes a mistake and goes too far. When he realizes it, he drops it all in the blink of an eye. It's also great how Millar manages to paint both Luthor and Superman as both hero and villain, and make it believeable, while staying true to the genre.</p><p></p><p>In terms of being a Superman story, there's much more depth to this than 'Superman becomes a global dictator.' It's a story that actually has a heart. And it has a great ending. Last time there was a Superman story with similar heart in the main books was Action #775 - Superman vs the Elite [Authority]. And before that, you have to really start reaching deep into the barrel. Godfall tried, but didn't quite make it, IMO.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Mark_Aurel, post: 1607088, member: 1725"] I would respectfully disagree with that. Superman in Red Son is one of the first renditions of Superman in quite a while to capture an essential 'Superman-ness' that's usually missing from the monthlies. All the essential elements of the mythos is there, bar kryptonite, though in different and unique ways. One of the more interesting aspects of the Superman character has always been his sociological impact. Superman has usually in the comics tended to adopt a passive stance with regards to humanity - he will fix big natural disasters and save lives, beat down alien invasions and such, but usually try to leave human social and technological development alone. There is a number of Superman stories in which he crosses that line, and those are remarkable for that reason alone. This issue, of Superman's sociological impact on humanity, was addressed by Elliot S. Maggin in the Silver Age, often considered the definitive Superman writer, when Superman was essentially put on trial by a cosmic tribunal of sorts. There have been many tales since in the same vein, such as the Armageddon 2001 Annual Elseworlds special from '91, where Superman becomes president of the US, or the more recent Superman: King of the World. Red Son is, in many ways, a more extended version of this kind of take on the character. The Superman movie (the first one, which is also by far the best) also had a very strong emphasis on this motif, with Jor-El's doctrine of non-interference in human history, which Superman violates in the end to save Lois Lane. Superman's motives in Red Son are inherently good. The triggering event that caused him to embark on the path he took was in issue #1, when he met Lana, and saw that people were starving, due to the inefficiencies of the communist system. 'Tell your friends they don't have to be scared or hungry anymore, comrades. Superman is here to rescue them.' That's a fairly nice and representative slogan for Superman, wouldn't you say? That's what his mission in this book is. To better humanity's lot. Now, a core conflict in Superman's character has always been the perfection - the 'super' - against the humanity. Superman isn't flawless. He makes mistakes. In Red Son, his mistake is that in saving humanity, he also makes humanity dependent upon him, taking away all freedom. The reprogrammed insurgents are both symbolic of this, and a form of foreshadowing. It is perhaps a somewhat blunt way of showing exactly where Superman is going too far. In the end, the defining moment of the book is when Superman realizes his error. When all hope seems lost, all resistance crushed, the single sentence that Luthor composed shows him his mistake. It is then shown that he has been manipulated by Brainiac for years; that is also shown previously in the conversations in #3. In this part of the story, Superman's defeat of Brainiac is highly symbolic of his coming to the realization that controlling humanity the way he has done is wrong. His final, heroic act, is to save the Earth from the exploding Brainiac vessel. That is also a thoroughly Superman-esque act, in the non-interventionistic sense. Self-sacrificing, noble, and heroic. Unlike a real dictator, Superman was never evil, vicious, or paranoid. He had certain ideals that he stood by. They were essentially the same as the regular Superman's, but colored by his communist background. That said, this story doesn't really have political undertones as much as it uses the political backdrop to tell a specific type of story, set in a familiar style. Any dictator is bad, no matter which 'system' or 'ideology' he confesses to. But sometimes, a dictator is better than the alternative. There have been other Superman stories which went in similar ways - Kingdom Come is one example. Superman makes mistake upon mistake in how he handles things, and in the end, it all comes crashing down on him. Kingdom Come has a lot of similarities to Red Son in that regard, except that there, Superman isn't alone. Kingdom Come had other themes too, such as the very 90ish conflict between 'humanity and superhumanity.' Red Son is a brilliant take on Superman, because it addresses not just most of the famous elements of the Superman mythology, and some of the DCU, but because of the way Superman is portrayed. As ever, he wants to help people - but he makes a mistake and goes too far. When he realizes it, he drops it all in the blink of an eye. It's also great how Millar manages to paint both Luthor and Superman as both hero and villain, and make it believeable, while staying true to the genre. In terms of being a Superman story, there's much more depth to this than 'Superman becomes a global dictator.' It's a story that actually has a heart. And it has a great ending. Last time there was a Superman story with similar heart in the main books was Action #775 - Superman vs the Elite [Authority]. And before that, you have to really start reaching deep into the barrel. Godfall tried, but didn't quite make it, IMO. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Geek Talk & Media
The Ultimates: Homeland Security
Top