The Undead..

[debalkez]

Hey everyone. I'm having my PC's enter into the undead area of monsters...in a haunted manor to retrieve the Wand of Ultimate Wonder.

I just had a few questions about the undead.

I'm a bit confused about the incorpereal. It means that the monsters (Allips and SHadows) cannot be affected by normal weapons, and magic weapons only have a 50% chance of success, right?

Also, is a Lich* too much to send at 6 level ones/twos?

*Stats:
HP: 72, AC: 21, Initiative +3, damage 1d8+5, special: The dead paralysis (DC 19 fortitude, seems dead, but with a DC 20 spot or DC 15 heal, notice they aren't.)

They are going up against, all together,
4 Allips, One Bodak, 5 Ghouls, 3 Ghasts, The Lich, Two Mummies, 12 skeletal warriors, and 2 vampires.

It seems like a lot, but they have some decent magic items. I'll give them some scrolls of undead turning and such...but any suggestions would be wonderful and greatly appreciated.

 

[CleverNickName]

Hey everyone. I'm having my PC's enter into the undead area of monsters...in a haunted manor to retrieve the Wand of Ultimate Wonder.

I just had a few questions about the undead.

I'm a bit confused about the incorpereal. It means that the monsters (Allips and SHadows) cannot be affected by normal weapons, and magic weapons only have a 50% chance of success, right?

Also, is a Lich* too much to send at 6 level ones/twos?

*Stats:
HP: 72, AC: 21, Initiative +3, damage 1d8+5, special: The dead paralysis (DC 19 fortitude, seems dead, but with a DC 20 spot or DC 15 heal, notice they aren't.)

They are going up against, all together,
4 Allips, One Bodak, 5 Ghouls, 3 Ghasts, The Lich, Two Mummies, 12 skeletal warriors, and 2 vampires.

It seems like a lot, but they have some decent magic items. I'll give them some scrolls of undead turning and such...but any suggestions would be wonderful and greatly appreciated.

This is probably a subject better suited to the Rules Forum...but since you asked...

1. Yes, that is exactly what it means to be Incorporeal. Incorporeal monsters can be very frustrating for players, and downright deadly for low-level ones.

2. Absolutely...the minimum caster level of a lich is 11...which is waaay too high for even 20, 2nd level characters. If you need an intelligent, spellcasting undead that won't totally decimate your party, you should probably start with a ghast or wight, and give it a couple of levels of sorcerer.

3. This monster assortment is far too powerful for your players...you are going to wipe your entire party out unless you seriously tip the scales in their favor. You should probably stick to skeletons, zombies, and ghouls until the party is at least 3rd level and has a good cleric.

Anyway. My two cents.

 

[Umbran]

I gotta agree, there. Unless there's something we don't know about going on, those monsters will wipe the floor with 1st and 2nd level characters.

I'll recommend you take a look at the DMG, the sections dealing with challenges and challenge ratings. They're only a rough guide, but they can give you a whole lot of basic insight into what your party can handle.

 

[debalkez]

So, if I use just zombies and skeletons and the like, what should my big bad boss be? A necromancer NPC, maybe?

 

[Nifft]

IMHO, it's fine to use a Lich BBEG... so long as that BBEG is absent. The PCs should find him around 14th level, if not after.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Umbran]

So, if I use just zombies and skeletons and the like, what should my big bad boss be? A necromancer NPC, maybe?

Clerics often make better masters of the undead than necromancers. That is, if you actually need a "boss" giving orders. Otherwise, just a larger group of undead can give you a thrilling end-fight.

 

[CleverNickName]

So, if I use just zombies and skeletons and the like, what should my big bad boss be? A necromancer NPC, maybe?

An evil cleric would work, but the cleric would have to be of a high enough level to cast animate dead. That's a minimum of 5th level, and that would probably still be too dangerous for a 2nd level party.

I'm with Nifft on this one. Perhaps the BBEG is somewhere else, and this is just a little outpost of his. He created all of the undead, and put one of his henchmen in charge to guard the wand until he needs it (or something like that). This henchmen would technically be the "boss" of this adventure, but he works for a RBBEG (Really Big Bad Evil Guy) that the party will run into much later in their careers.

This would create a whole slew of adventure hooks that you can build several adventures around. In this adventure, for example, the party finds the wand. A few adventures later, the lich discovers his wand has been stolen, and sends a more powerful troupe of undead to go fetch it. The party starts wondering why the wand is so important to Mr. BigBad Lich, so they take it to a sage who informs them that it must be destroyed because of some obscure prophecy or whatever. So the party sets out on a quest to destroy the wand, which can only be done at some sacred temple somewhere. The lich learns about what they are trying to do and tries to stop them, etc. etc.

Another two cents, anyway. Okay, more like a dime, but...

 

[Nifft]

So here's what happened.

Mr. Human Lich Necromancer and his Goblin Cleric cohort teleport into town; the Lich throws around some fell animate cloudkill spells or fell animate fireball spells, or whatever, and bingo -- they got minions. The Cleric uses his Rebuke Undead to command these low-hit die critters, and the town dies. Perhaps the Cleric had some pet ghouls or ghasts? They feed, and accidentally leave some spawn behind.

The BBEGs accomplish their goal, and leave.

The PCs job? Clean up the undead in the town; find a clue as to why the BBEGs were there.

This scenario can continue until the PCs finally catch the evildoers.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Kurashu]

If you want an intelligent undead spellcasting Undead but what something lichy, use a Necropolitian (Libris Mortis). As the campaign evolves, have him transform into a lich. Now, if that means taking levels in Dread Necromancer (Heroes of Horror) to make it gradual or just hand waving the requirement of "humanoid" for the lich template, although the Necropolitian does have the "augment humanoid" subtype so it isn't too far of a stretch.

However, I also like Nifft's idea.

 

[Tonguez]

Ghouls are intelligent and can take class levels

Use a Ghoul Necromancer Wizard as the BBEG and ou may even convince the Players that they are facing a lich

Ghosts are also kewl...