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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Merlion" data-source="post: 3123608" data-attributes="member: 10397">I'm not saying people cant improve their skills in a given craft. I'm saying that just because a person doesnt like something, wether they have "credentials" or not, and/or just because a work of art or literature doesnt adhere to a certain set of rules or guidlines, wether layed down by "experts" or not, doesnt bereft it of value. Because as Wombat said, if someone doesnt enjoy a work, it means it didnt have value for them, but not that it is valueless universally. Yes, I'm sure thats true. And?It doesnt make their opinions anything more than opinions, or even neccesarily any more valid than anyone else's opinion.  I dont have a problem with someone having certain crtiteria or guidlines of quality of craft. You can determine what generally works well, and appeals to large numbers of people. Where I have a problem is when people decide that a work is objectively, totally "bad" and worthless, for everyone, no matter what, and that if you do enjoy it, its because your tastes are deficient. And they generally seem to judge these things based on the notion that "expert's" opinions are more than just opinions, they are the final word of "good" and "bad" for everyone in the world, despite the fact that I dont understand how there can be "good" and "bad" in an area that by its nature is subjective. As I said you can maybe have standards of craft to a point, but even those are subjective. Well ok. What are they then? And who decided what they are, and how? And how can those basis themselves be anything other than subjective? No, I'm not. The people I see degrading and belittling works because they use a plot thats been used before (despite the fact that as WayeLigon says, ALL the plots have been used before) are the ones making that simple dichotomy. You really and truly believe that someone can spend time and effort, and thought and feeling, but the results are worthless unless they meet certain criteria set down by other people?I just really dont see how thats possible. And heres another issue as well. The issue of purpose, and the fact that a lot of something's value is based on wether it succeeds or fails at that purpose.Me, I feel that most artistic works are meant to serve a couple of basic purposes. One, to bring enjoyment to their creator, and those that view/read/hear it. Two, to satisfy the creators creative impulses.  So to me, a work that the creator enjoys making, and that people enjoy experiencing, even if others dont enjoy it, has fullfilled its purpose, and is thereby of value. Now of course some works are also meant to convey a certain message or feeling, and I suppose could be said to succeed or fail based on that, but again chances are it will succeed with some and fail with others</blockquote>

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