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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Merlion" data-source="post: 3124759" data-attributes="member: 10397">Well, I'm not sure what the point of your writing the post was if you dont plan to continue, and I dont think we need to "agree to disagree" (I hate that phrase with a burning passion), partially because I dont think we really and truly disagree on much. I am going to respond, and I wish strongly that you would respond to the response as your input has been among the most interesting, useful and well thought out I've had since I started this whole issue up.  I have two questions then. One, how exactly does this seperation of enjoyment from quality work? To me, especially if the work is mainly meant to be enjoyed, as most artistic works are even if they have other purposes as well, then if people enjoy the thing, its a good work. And certainly, it has *value*Related to that, again if the work is enjoyed, even if one accepts the idea that their are semi-objective levels of quality in craft, and a work is on the lower end of that scale, what does it matter other than to mean the artist has room to improve and make his works even more enjoyable, by an even wider audience? All the things you mention are entirely subjective.  I agree, in a way...although to me its more simply that you didnt enjoy it and its nature was not to your taste, but it was to mine.  Not quite. I dont believe "well written" is entirely an objective thing, in practice. I did however say that it is not as well written as some others.  Whats the difference? Here we disagree, if I understand what you mean. To me, for a work to be objectively bad, even just in terms of craft with value aside, it would have to fail all common criteria for its medium. Basically it would need to be unreadble. Because all those criteria are themselves still subjective, not objective.  I only have one real "standard" in terms of my own personal reading/watching etc...how much I enjoyed it.There is another factor, one I dont consider exactly a standard...wether, and how much a work has some huge lasting impact on me...causes an epiphany, creates a totally new sensation, or becomes a permanent, large part of my mental landscape. I can critique things based on the accepted standards of "good" writing reasonbly well, but they are essentially just a collection of commonly held opinions. I wouldnt say its not well written. I'd say its not *as* well written as so-and-so. Its relative.  They objectively fit the common opinion of bad, rather.  I dont think we truly disagree on much. You consider the commonly held standards of the craft of writing to be objective, which I only partially agree with, but your not trying to say works that dont fit those standards are worthless and anyone who enjoys them is deficient.</blockquote>

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