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Message: <blockquote data-quote="phloog" data-source="post: 4488663" data-attributes="member: 59219">As noted, I just think that my own (and my groups) tolerance for laboring to rationalize is not more than offset by the fun level of 4e. I think that maybe my point becomes more critical to me when I think about a different scenario...I realize that single situations are always problematic, but I think this could be extended to lots of less extreme cases.  Here goes: Reverse the situation.   YOU are playing a frail magic-using character that you have spent nearly all of your resources turning into a long-ranged magic powerhouse with a steel will and a brilliant tactical mind.   In fact, as part of the concept, he is so snooty and feels himself so superior to rank-and-file warriors that he carries no physical weapons, relying only on his mighty magic. The DM places you in a combat where a warrior character uses CAGI on YOU.   Now YOUR character's actions are dictated by the DM - No matter how much of your own character concept has been focused on them being cool, calm, collected and completely unwilling to enter combat...no matter how many feats, advancements, points, or magic items you have devoted to being master of your own actions, suddenly either: A) your character goes berzerk and rushes to attack with his bare hands,  or  B) Some miraculous hand-wavy distortion of space occurs - or you assume that the grid depiction was off by a bit and your wizard was there the whole time A) is bad because it ignores everything about the situation except for this figher's power, which trumps ALL other stats and decisions and the essential 'reality' of the situation.  Maybe more Magic: The Gathering-y than videogamy, but still a problem....you are mind controlled by a warrior. B) is bad because it also makes no sense.... Actually, it might make a little sense against orcs.  They are A) and or B) - - some were taunted to attack, some were closer to start with. But in this example what you are saying is that this wizard who openly avoids combat and is a tactical genius has somehow accidentally moved next to the warrior and didn't realize it.     The abstract grid just doesn't happen to match the actual situation, but you must now assume that the wizard player screwed up completely in terms of position. And again, the issue is not so much this on its own, but this happening with no consideration of the wizards abilities/stats/resistances/etc.  The fighter makes the wizard stupid for a second, without requiring any sort of check.</blockquote>

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