Sollir Furryfoot
Explorer
Small note on the holy white mage spells-make it so that it does real damage to undead and maybe if it reduces an undead creature to 0 hits it destroys their bodies (undead are immune to subdual anyways).
The White Magician
- Thread starter I'm A Banana
- Start date
CrimsonOgre
First Post
I would give the 'Holy' spells a certain amount of Disruption damage, as per the rules in the DMG. That would mimic the 'Harm' spells that White Mage used in Final Fantasy 1, 2j, and 3j.
A word about the psionic style casting that you're looking into:
In the first three Final Fantasies, there wasn't MP. You had spells per day just like in D&D. And you didn't have many. the spells per day of a Wizard more closely follows the original Final Fantasy.
Maybe I'm too old-school, but that's just me.
A word about the psionic style casting that you're looking into:
In the first three Final Fantasies, there wasn't MP. You had spells per day just like in D&D. And you didn't have many. the spells per day of a Wizard more closely follows the original Final Fantasy.
Maybe I'm too old-school, but that's just me.
I'm A Banana
Potassium-Rich
That's the reason I did it this way originally. Most likely, I'll keep the way it is, and then include MP for a way to universalize it.
Because of the highly flexible nature of the FF games, I want to keep this as modular as possible. Eventually, once I get a baseline of classes, I want to branch out into each individual game and introduce special rules and regulations for each (like Materia in the world of FF7, or MagiTech in FF6, etc.)
But that's still a bit down the road. Right now, I want to get the basic classes and races, and a few supplemental rules, for adding a good FF "feel" to a world. After that, I'm on to each world's wigginess.
And I'm saying that the spells deal subdual damage to any creature that can take subdual damage, and normal damage to anything else. Probably.
Jack Daniel
Legend
I would like to note that in a Final Fantasy RPG, presumably based on the golden age of FF, the 16-bit pre-sci-fi era, that there is no need to make new classes. Observe:
Knight - identical to the fighter
Monk - in D&D too
Berserker - identical to the barbarian
Thief - D&D rogue
White Mage - a healer who isn't an armored knight like a cleric... sounds like a shaman
Black Mage - caster who centers on elemental attacks... looks like a wu jen
Red Mage - combines white and black magic... could be a shugenja
Time Mage - magic that deals damage and special effects... very wizard
Oracle - much like the time mage, sorcerer might work -- but it fits the final fantasy paradigm better to drop spell preparation and make everyone cast as a sorcerer
Samurai - what do you know, that's also a D&D class
Bard - once again, D&D class
Paladin - I think there's a trend here...
Ryuukishi (I refuse to call them dragoons, they're Dragon Knights!), Alchemists, Mimics, Blue Mages, and Dancers might actually need new classes, but Ryuukishi could be samurai/cavaliers. The same goes for the Maho-Kenshi (at different times called Mage Knight, Dark Knight, Paladin, and Sorcerer), but psychic warrior is a good approximation for the FF5 version, while the sohei is very like the FF3 concept.
Knight - identical to the fighter
Monk - in D&D too
Berserker - identical to the barbarian
Thief - D&D rogue
White Mage - a healer who isn't an armored knight like a cleric... sounds like a shaman
Black Mage - caster who centers on elemental attacks... looks like a wu jen
Red Mage - combines white and black magic... could be a shugenja
Time Mage - magic that deals damage and special effects... very wizard
Oracle - much like the time mage, sorcerer might work -- but it fits the final fantasy paradigm better to drop spell preparation and make everyone cast as a sorcerer
Samurai - what do you know, that's also a D&D class
Bard - once again, D&D class
Paladin - I think there's a trend here...
Ryuukishi (I refuse to call them dragoons, they're Dragon Knights!), Alchemists, Mimics, Blue Mages, and Dancers might actually need new classes, but Ryuukishi could be samurai/cavaliers. The same goes for the Maho-Kenshi (at different times called Mage Knight, Dark Knight, Paladin, and Sorcerer), but psychic warrior is a good approximation for the FF5 version, while the sohei is very like the FF3 concept.
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DreamChaser
Explorer
Sollir Furryfoot said:
They already do this...at least the normal damage part.
I'm A Banana
Potassium-Rich
Well, I'm not basing it on any one era of FF...more a conglomorate of eras. A lil' here, a lil' there, and then allow each individual world to have it's own take.
FFI is probably the closest to D&D propper that I know of, with Fighter = Fighter, Knight = Paladin, Black Belt = Monk, Master = High level monk, Thief = Rogue, Black Mage = Wizard, White Mage = Cleric, Red Mage = Bard. The only one that doesn't fit is the Ninja, which would end up being something like a Ranger who used spells like Magic Missle or Acid Arrow instead of Magic Fang and Entangle.
I know everyone has their favorite FF's, and some are die-hard old-skoolers, and some like the new take. I hope to eventually be able to cater to all tastes, with the "generic" classes like this being closer to the D&D norm so that you can add them in for flavor, and so the individual worlds have a point of reference.
There are some existing classes that fit OK for a class....but it's still a bit of an awkward fit with some extra baggage. Especially if you want to emulate specific games...
"Knight" could mean a lot of things depending upon the FF you're talking about, for instance. With Tactics, they're equipment-breakers. With FFX's Auron, they're reducers of stats and wielders of two-handed big arse swords who hit hard but not often. You could probably describe the heroes of FFVII and VIII as Knights, even, with their variation's on Cyan's Sword Techniques.
"Monks" in FF are more than just unarmored fighters. D&D monks can't do anything like Chakra (healing some HP instantly) or Kick (hitting all foes with one attack) or even some of the supernatural powers of Sabin in FFVI (things like Aura Bolt or Spiraller come to mind...).
"Berserkers" are different than barbarians because you have control over what a barbarian does -- not so with a berserker. Berserkers also don't get movement powers or damage reduction or uncanny dodge. They take the damage and like it.
"Theives" are D&D rogues souped up. They can't sneak attack, but their speed is unparallelled, and I've never seen a rogue swipe the cions out of a pouch or the clothes off a foe in the middle of battle, either....
"Samurai" varies greatly on the FF version...you've got the Sword Techniques of Cyan from FFVI (nothing like them exist in D&D), and the draw-outs of the FF Tactics Samurai (again, nothing like them in D&D).
Shamans have those extra animal friends/punching powers that white mages never had. Wu Jens have more versatility than a black mage ever had. Red Mages are closer to D&D bards than they are to anything else (what with the combo of attack, defense, and martial skills). Time mages can't use Fireball (Oracles are largely the same thing, in the generic version), and FF Bards sing more than D&D bards, and can't cast magic.
While you can do a sort of semi-FF style using no new classes, I think that the FF classes are different enough, especially when taken in overall effect, that they definately deserve their own classes.
I mean, sure, there's a bit of similarity -- but mostly it's superficial. The gulf between Sabin and a traditional D&D Monk is at least as wide as the gulf between a D&D Monk and a D&D Fighter.
Thankfully, it's still tryin' to be modular...so if you think the OA Samurai works just fine, then you don't have to worry about it -- the only think you can possibly loose is a choice.
FFI is probably the closest to D&D propper that I know of, with Fighter = Fighter, Knight = Paladin, Black Belt = Monk, Master = High level monk, Thief = Rogue, Black Mage = Wizard, White Mage = Cleric, Red Mage = Bard. The only one that doesn't fit is the Ninja, which would end up being something like a Ranger who used spells like Magic Missle or Acid Arrow instead of Magic Fang and Entangle.
I know everyone has their favorite FF's, and some are die-hard old-skoolers, and some like the new take. I hope to eventually be able to cater to all tastes, with the "generic" classes like this being closer to the D&D norm so that you can add them in for flavor, and so the individual worlds have a point of reference.
There are some existing classes that fit OK for a class....but it's still a bit of an awkward fit with some extra baggage. Especially if you want to emulate specific games...
"Knight" could mean a lot of things depending upon the FF you're talking about, for instance. With Tactics, they're equipment-breakers. With FFX's Auron, they're reducers of stats and wielders of two-handed big arse swords who hit hard but not often. You could probably describe the heroes of FFVII and VIII as Knights, even, with their variation's on Cyan's Sword Techniques.
"Monks" in FF are more than just unarmored fighters. D&D monks can't do anything like Chakra (healing some HP instantly) or Kick (hitting all foes with one attack) or even some of the supernatural powers of Sabin in FFVI (things like Aura Bolt or Spiraller come to mind...).
"Berserkers" are different than barbarians because you have control over what a barbarian does -- not so with a berserker. Berserkers also don't get movement powers or damage reduction or uncanny dodge. They take the damage and like it.
"Theives" are D&D rogues souped up. They can't sneak attack, but their speed is unparallelled, and I've never seen a rogue swipe the cions out of a pouch or the clothes off a foe in the middle of battle, either....
"Samurai" varies greatly on the FF version...you've got the Sword Techniques of Cyan from FFVI (nothing like them exist in D&D), and the draw-outs of the FF Tactics Samurai (again, nothing like them in D&D).
Shamans have those extra animal friends/punching powers that white mages never had. Wu Jens have more versatility than a black mage ever had. Red Mages are closer to D&D bards than they are to anything else (what with the combo of attack, defense, and martial skills). Time mages can't use Fireball (Oracles are largely the same thing, in the generic version), and FF Bards sing more than D&D bards, and can't cast magic.
While you can do a sort of semi-FF style using no new classes, I think that the FF classes are different enough, especially when taken in overall effect, that they definately deserve their own classes.
I mean, sure, there's a bit of similarity -- but mostly it's superficial. The gulf between Sabin and a traditional D&D Monk is at least as wide as the gulf between a D&D Monk and a D&D Fighter.
Thankfully, it's still tryin' to be modular...so if you think the OA Samurai works just fine, then you don't have to worry about it -- the only think you can possibly loose is a choice.
