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Message: <blockquote data-quote="RFisher" data-source="post: 3691484" data-attributes="member: 3608">In the end, there just no getting around the fact that my 3e PCs seem to fail at things I expect them to be decent at much more often than I expect.I don't, however, really blame 3e for this.This was often true of my Gurps PCs too, by the way.Based on the stories of the original Greyhawk campaign, I'd say skills were left out because the LG crew didn't think these were things that having rules or often making rolls for added to the fun. They genuinely felt it was better to leave a whole lot up to DM fiat.Gary himself has obviously changed his mind somewhat about this, but his "skill-bundles" in both LA & C&C are still closer to classes (i.e. very broad skills) or 1e secondary skills than most other game's skill systems.Using a bell-curve (mid20, 3d6, whatever) for skill checks while keeping the linear roll (d20) for combat works well, IMHO.In fact, there was a guy who developed the opposite solution for his TFT game: Use a d20 roll for combat while keeping the game's original 2d6 (nd6 really) rolls for everything else.But the real problem, IMHO, is that there has been a general trend in the hobby to roll dice more often. Too many things that should be automatic success (or for which the chance of failure should be much lower than the actual roll used; or which should just be glossed over to get to what the group is really interested in) get rolled for.This isn't really a systematic defect of 3e. It can occur in any system (an 1e DM calling for ability checks for everything PCs do), & it can be avoided in any system (a 3e DM setting DCs based on how easy/difficult he thinks this task should be for this character in this situation ignoring what the module or skill descriptions say). I've witnessed both.And, I have to admit, rolling the dice is fun. I'm very interested in finding ways to have rolls that aren't pass/fail. Adequate success v. exceptional success can give you the fun of rolling without the consequence of feeling incompetent.3e still has a DM, though, who can smooth over any warts in the system. In the final analysis, I don't think it is the skill system itself is a reason that I prefer classic D&D over 3e, it's the level of detail. (Or fiddly-bits or complexity or something along those lines.)</blockquote>

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