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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Campbell" data-source="post: 1385782" data-attributes="member: 16586">Long, but Hopefully Worthwhile Post on Social Skills    Although the side-tangeant of how to play out soical skills in our games, doesn't rreally belong here, I'll try to comment. Let's take a look at what our social skills actually do according to the SRD: First Diplomacy:     Commentary: It seems Diplomacy isn't the be all/end all decisive factor for social situations. It allows you to alter an NPC's perceptions, but Diplomacy isn't Dominate. It can't force someone to do something they wouldn't normally do, and it still requires players to direct conversations to get what they want. Just because someone is willing to be helpful that doesn't always mean that they are going to do exactly what you want them to. They also need to know what you want, and quite often this requires conversation, to hammer out the details.     The secondary effect on Negotiation is a bit tricky here, but I'm going to go out on a limb and say that the advantage referred to here isn't all encompassing based on some experience with contaract negotiations I've had. The third affect is basically the same as the second, except that you are dealing with a third party whose needs and desires might not fit into line with either of the arguing parties' agenda. Now Let's Look at Bluff: Commentary: Beyond the combat applications Bluff is a much more straight-forward skill than Diplomacy is. Basically you're trying to get someone to believe something they wouldn't otherwise believe, which can be as simple or convoluted as you want it to be.  However Bluffs like "I'm not you're enemy" or "This sword is worth more gold than you've ever seen in your life" aren't what I'd call highly believable without further explanation. There are modifiers built into the skill system that already govern this viabiity by my estimates. Here's Gather Info: Commentary: Gather Info is pretty much a game-time saver skill. It's not really meant to dole out information that's too specific. This kind of information should probably be in the line of general inklings, since the skill indicates that the character using it isn't spending too much time with any given individual. I think it's also important to take the 'May Draw Attention to Yourself' clause. Now Here's Intimidate: Commentary: Not much to say here. Beyond being opposed by a level check the only real social ramifications of this skill are similar to the Influencing NPC Attitude portion of the Diplomacy skill. And Finally Sense Motive: Commentary: Sense Motive is an anomaly in that unlike all the other 'social' skills it is reactive. It's major use as a social skill is in detecting bluffs which really doesn't need much illiteration. The hunch mechanism on the other hand seems like a nice effect that you could use to alter your descriptions as a DM. General Commentary: I think it's important to take a look at how the rules actually handle things before we get embroiled in an arguement over how things should be handled in our games. I say handle them how you like to handle them, but keep in mind what the designers of D&D had in mind if you like to do that sort of thing.      Generally speaking I like how these skills function by default. I don't believe that they discourage roleplaying, but rather encourage roleplaying while adding a 'character gradient' into the mix. To each their own. * Thanks for this debate guys. It gave me an extra spurt of energy this morning.</blockquote>

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