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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Flamestrike" data-source="post: 6619092" data-attributes="member: 6788736">I dont get this. The arrow to the neck is just as much of a threat as the axe to the face. In fact, the weedy looking dude with the pointy hat lurking all the way at the back of the room is probably the even bigger threat than the hairy dude in front of you with an axe. That poindexter in the hat can probably kill you by pointing at you and saying a single word. While flying.That said, I've always maintained that its totally OK if you (as the DM) rule that the monster wasnt looking, was distracted and missed the Rogues attack and allow a second Hide attempt (likely at disadvantage). I sometimes allow the same thing myself. Depends on the circumstances.I just make a ruling and run with it. One that makes sense, is fun, balanced and consistent.Read that sidebar again and tell me its written as a game rule.Compare it to the text of a feat or class feature.Please. This will help you interpret it. Look at the context.Why? How can the Rogue player argue with you about what the creature (run by you) notices? He cant argue with the other players about what they're noticing.It's your monster. You rule what it does and doesn't notice. By default its assumed to notice the Rogue as soon as he breaks hiding, and will forever more (unless the Rogue can get to a place where the Monster no longer knows where he is). Simply by allowing the Rogue to occasionally try again with disadvantage despite being under observation by a monster is allowing the Rogue to do something he normally couldn't do.And if the player keeps arguing after that, point him to the bit in the Rule book that refers to 'DM's call'. If he keeps arguing for an hour after that after that politely pull him aside and remind him it's a game and he needs to chill out.Nah Bro. That's searching. As in: 'I suspect this warehouse contains a hidden creature; I'll actively stop and listen and look around intently and carefully'Passive perception is just always on. Its what you pick up without actively trying.Try and argue with it at my table. I'll listen to your rule, explain why I think it works the way I do. Listen to your argument. Quick check of the rulebook, then make a call; this is how it works. For everyone. We can talk about it later after the session. After that time, its how it works for ever.Arguments happen, but its up to the DM to put a stop to them. No rule discussion lasts longer than 1 minute in my games; the player gets a chance to correct the DM on a rule but ultimately the DM's interpretation trumps the players. If there is no resolution, then DM's call (which we all agree to abide by no matter who is DM), discuss it after the game or during the week.I certainly wouldnt let a player crap on to me about it for an hour afterwards, or argue with me (or whoever was DMing) at the table. That's just poor sportsmanship.</blockquote>

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