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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Helldritch" data-source="post: 8558551" data-attributes="member: 6855114">The problem with nerfing or removing damage cantrips in 5ed is that it was done for a balance reason. Spells no longer scale with level and got their damage fixed to slots. Spell slots were drastically reduced compared to their 1ed and 2ed counter parts. Magic items were also drastically reduced. Wands had 100 charges and could be used until they ran out of them. The user of a wand of fire was not limited to 7 fireballs per day but could cast up to 50 if needed.The same goes along with the lessen spell slots, a 20th level 1ed wizard could cast 5/5/5/5/5/4/3/3/2. Compare this to the pitiful 4/3/3/3/3/2/2/1. And the fact that the fireballs of the 1ed wizard would do up to 20d6, his magic missiles would do 10d4+10. The 5th edition wizard without cantrip simply can't do the same amount of damage. Upcast is great, but hardly on par with what the 1ed wizard could do. All this was to give a fighting chance to the wizard. With only 1 attack per round, if the wizard misses, it's over while the martial can have at least two chances to hit and be meaningful. Even the rogue can use a bonus action to get a second chance for a sneak. The wizard came from being the main damage dealer of a group at high level to a support cast better at control than damage. Even his ability to boost the other offensive capacity or his own defenses have been reduced through the concentration mechanic. So... what is the problem with having powerful cantrips when the wizard has been, in all but name, almost completely defanged? And here you could add the sorcerer too. Yes they are still pretty much powerful, that much is obvious. But they are no longer on the scale of 1ed. If you truly want to reduce or remove cantrips then you have to augment the amount of spell slots and make damage from spells not only rise by spell slots but also by level. Otherwise, the casters will no longer be a treath. Unless that is your goal and not see anyone eager to play a caster?</blockquote>

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