Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
This Game is Deadly
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Tony Vargas" data-source="post: 6346630" data-attributes="member: 996"><p>We really don't. We know that, this time around, there was a public playtest and a survey, and that they quoted the number of people who signed up for the playtest, in total, and the number of responses - two carefully selected statistics that shed no light on whether the playtest started strong and dropped off or gained playtesters as wit went, nor on what the composition of that self-selected population was like. And we don't know how 'different' everything else was, because they never shared the methodology or results, just their conclusions. </p><p></p><p>When WotC came out and said there were certain fan-identified problems with 3.5 and fixed them in 4e, there was outrage from certain quarters, and relief in finally seeing those problems fixed in others. Now, they're essentially doing the same thing, hammering on edition-war-complaints about slow combat and grid-dependence and releasing 5e as nominally-TotM with monsters and PCs all but made of glass in comparison to make combats short & deadly. But somehow it's different?</p><p></p><p> You'd have to know something about the methodology in all 3 cases to make the comparison. We don't know anything about them.</p><p></p><p>All we had, in all three cases, is boosters of the then-new ed or half-ed saying that it had to be what the fans wanted because 'market research!'</p><p></p><p> I suppose I should take a page from ScottC and try to re-assure you that the general patterns I'm seeing from 2000, 2008, & 2010 recurring today are not in any way an attack on you personally. They're not. Please don't feel like I'm singling you out, you're just saying things that are reminiscent, not the exact same things - and you're not alone.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Tony Vargas, post: 6346630, member: 996"] We really don't. We know that, this time around, there was a public playtest and a survey, and that they quoted the number of people who signed up for the playtest, in total, and the number of responses - two carefully selected statistics that shed no light on whether the playtest started strong and dropped off or gained playtesters as wit went, nor on what the composition of that self-selected population was like. And we don't know how 'different' everything else was, because they never shared the methodology or results, just their conclusions. When WotC came out and said there were certain fan-identified problems with 3.5 and fixed them in 4e, there was outrage from certain quarters, and relief in finally seeing those problems fixed in others. Now, they're essentially doing the same thing, hammering on edition-war-complaints about slow combat and grid-dependence and releasing 5e as nominally-TotM with monsters and PCs all but made of glass in comparison to make combats short & deadly. But somehow it's different? You'd have to know something about the methodology in all 3 cases to make the comparison. We don't know anything about them. All we had, in all three cases, is boosters of the then-new ed or half-ed saying that it had to be what the fans wanted because 'market research!' I suppose I should take a page from ScottC and try to re-assure you that the general patterns I'm seeing from 2000, 2008, & 2010 recurring today are not in any way an attack on you personally. They're not. Please don't feel like I'm singling you out, you're just saying things that are reminiscent, not the exact same things - and you're not alone. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
This Game is Deadly
Top