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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
This tells me OSR is alive and well.
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<blockquote data-quote="Mannahnin" data-source="post: 9372954" data-attributes="member: 7026594"><p>Yeah, the math if you need to pass at both Find AND Remove Traps is absurd.</p><p></p><p></p><p>A key thing to understand when adjudicating Hide in Shadows and Move Silently is that you are rarely rolling both of them. Hiding is for when you're stationary. Moving Silently is for moving.</p><p></p><p>As with Find/Remove Traps, if you need to roll them both your odds go from bad to absurdly bad.</p><p></p><p></p><p>The Fighter also has more HP and can use all the magic weapons on the charts, where the Cleric can only use 6.25% of those on the Basic charts (the Mace +1), and 6% of those from the Expert charts. The Cleric can obviously use a bunch of other items, but in terms of combat prowess it's hard for them to even get a magic weapon, where Fighters will normally expect to have at least one by 2nd level, and their ability to use magic swords is almost a class ability.</p><p></p><p>I can't buy into the "they all suck at the start" argument. IMO it's a false equivalency. Everyone is fragile, sure, but everyone else has stuff they're legitimately good at. The Thief is actively terrible at their own specialty, and more fragile than anyone except the guy who's routinely carrying a "nuke an encounter" button.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Definitely with you there on smoothing the attack progressions. Dwarves are a bit tricky in terms of being not much more XP than a Fighter for everything they get and the minimal amount they lose. Giving Fighters a damage bonus or Cleave or something is nice. Or the Sweep rule (attack 1x/level against 1HD or less creatures) or the upgraded version which isn't purely capped at 1HD critters (attack a number of times = monsters' HD divided into your level).</p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes, LL has armor prices based on AD&D, which I'm less fond of.</p><p></p><p></p><p>All Rogues are that way in T&T, taking after Vance and Leiber. They can learn spells but don't have a guild to teach them, so they have to find them.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Was it Jason Cone AKA Philotomy Jurament, of Philotomy's Musings fame, who originally came up with this interpretation?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Mannahnin, post: 9372954, member: 7026594"] Yeah, the math if you need to pass at both Find AND Remove Traps is absurd. A key thing to understand when adjudicating Hide in Shadows and Move Silently is that you are rarely rolling both of them. Hiding is for when you're stationary. Moving Silently is for moving. As with Find/Remove Traps, if you need to roll them both your odds go from bad to absurdly bad. The Fighter also has more HP and can use all the magic weapons on the charts, where the Cleric can only use 6.25% of those on the Basic charts (the Mace +1), and 6% of those from the Expert charts. The Cleric can obviously use a bunch of other items, but in terms of combat prowess it's hard for them to even get a magic weapon, where Fighters will normally expect to have at least one by 2nd level, and their ability to use magic swords is almost a class ability. I can't buy into the "they all suck at the start" argument. IMO it's a false equivalency. Everyone is fragile, sure, but everyone else has stuff they're legitimately good at. The Thief is actively terrible at their own specialty, and more fragile than anyone except the guy who's routinely carrying a "nuke an encounter" button. Definitely with you there on smoothing the attack progressions. Dwarves are a bit tricky in terms of being not much more XP than a Fighter for everything they get and the minimal amount they lose. Giving Fighters a damage bonus or Cleave or something is nice. Or the Sweep rule (attack 1x/level against 1HD or less creatures) or the upgraded version which isn't purely capped at 1HD critters (attack a number of times = monsters' HD divided into your level). Yes, LL has armor prices based on AD&D, which I'm less fond of. All Rogues are that way in T&T, taking after Vance and Leiber. They can learn spells but don't have a guild to teach them, so they have to find them. Was it Jason Cone AKA Philotomy Jurament, of Philotomy's Musings fame, who originally came up with this interpretation? [/QUOTE]
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D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
This tells me OSR is alive and well.
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