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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Thoughts of a 3E/4E powergamer on starting to play 5E
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<blockquote data-quote="Imaro" data-source="post: 6876050" data-attributes="member: 48965"><p>Wow, could our group (and others) be an anomaly... I've had people survive from 1st level to 10th/12th playing fighters... and judging by other accounts so have quite a few other groups... so when you say "survivable without having to pay for it" I think that at least some of us are experiencing that from level 1. Perhaps it's the play style necessary to survive that you don't enjoy...which is all fine and good but doesn't actually prove that characters aren't survivable out of the gate... just that you don't play in a style that the game rewards with surviving at that level. In fact I would wager there are many players finding the characters quite survivable without having to pay for it at level 1 and as they get higher, well from experience it gets harder to actually kill characters in 5e.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p> </p><p></p><p>Being a tank/defender in any edition has always been about taking one for the team... and as far as being awesome, well if that isn't "awesome" to you then why do you want to play a tank? </p><p></p><p>Well in 4e when I chose to be a Swordmage I was great at damage mitigation and sucked at dealing damage and there was no easy way to mitigate it without expenditure of resources... and even then I couldn't hit like a striker. The only Defender that could get close to striker numbers was the fighter and that was because by the end of 4e the class was a bit overpowered due to how much support had been heaped upon it... but that wasn't the case with all classes or all roles. In the end selecting a class in 4e was a constraint in that you wouldn't be as good at some of the other roles as other characters were. </p><p></p><p>Now as far as your "awesome" goes it seems from this and previous posts... you want a character that can't be hit or hurt but also that does massive damage in combat... and the problem is that 5e's mechanics are making it difficult for you to attain combat superiority in attaining both of these things without investment of resources. Well, can't say I'm all that broke up about it not catering to that specific definition of awesome (especially at level 1) but I guess if that's your only way to have fun well then low level 5e is probably not for you... perhaps join in on the game once they've reached 3rd or 4th level. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Uhm... being less good at the other roles is exactly what selecting a class (and thus role) in 4e means... the main difference is that 4e baked it into the classes more heavily than 5e does.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I guessed I picked it up from the descriptions for the tiers of play... not sure what else to tell you. If you have no experience with any edition (including 3.x) then you know low level characters are fragile in D&D and if you don't have any experience with D&D well then you don't have expectations. I don't think 5e wildly swings between anything... IME it's a steady rise as you go higher and higher in level... but then again I think the books sets you up to expect that. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>5e is no harder to houserule than 2e and 3e low level play was also very dangerous/swingy... just like every edition except 4e.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Imaro, post: 6876050, member: 48965"] Wow, could our group (and others) be an anomaly... I've had people survive from 1st level to 10th/12th playing fighters... and judging by other accounts so have quite a few other groups... so when you say "survivable without having to pay for it" I think that at least some of us are experiencing that from level 1. Perhaps it's the play style necessary to survive that you don't enjoy...which is all fine and good but doesn't actually prove that characters aren't survivable out of the gate... just that you don't play in a style that the game rewards with surviving at that level. In fact I would wager there are many players finding the characters quite survivable without having to pay for it at level 1 and as they get higher, well from experience it gets harder to actually kill characters in 5e. Being a tank/defender in any edition has always been about taking one for the team... and as far as being awesome, well if that isn't "awesome" to you then why do you want to play a tank? Well in 4e when I chose to be a Swordmage I was great at damage mitigation and sucked at dealing damage and there was no easy way to mitigate it without expenditure of resources... and even then I couldn't hit like a striker. The only Defender that could get close to striker numbers was the fighter and that was because by the end of 4e the class was a bit overpowered due to how much support had been heaped upon it... but that wasn't the case with all classes or all roles. In the end selecting a class in 4e was a constraint in that you wouldn't be as good at some of the other roles as other characters were. Now as far as your "awesome" goes it seems from this and previous posts... you want a character that can't be hit or hurt but also that does massive damage in combat... and the problem is that 5e's mechanics are making it difficult for you to attain combat superiority in attaining both of these things without investment of resources. Well, can't say I'm all that broke up about it not catering to that specific definition of awesome (especially at level 1) but I guess if that's your only way to have fun well then low level 5e is probably not for you... perhaps join in on the game once they've reached 3rd or 4th level. Uhm... being less good at the other roles is exactly what selecting a class (and thus role) in 4e means... the main difference is that 4e baked it into the classes more heavily than 5e does. I guessed I picked it up from the descriptions for the tiers of play... not sure what else to tell you. If you have no experience with any edition (including 3.x) then you know low level characters are fragile in D&D and if you don't have any experience with D&D well then you don't have expectations. I don't think 5e wildly swings between anything... IME it's a steady rise as you go higher and higher in level... but then again I think the books sets you up to expect that. 5e is no harder to houserule than 2e and 3e low level play was also very dangerous/swingy... just like every edition except 4e. [/QUOTE]
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