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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
Thoughts of a 3E/4E powergamer on starting to play 5E
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<blockquote data-quote="Imaro" data-source="post: 6881782" data-attributes="member: 48965"><p>Look @<em><strong><u><a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=6689464" target="_blank">MoonSong</a></u></strong></em> it honestly doesn't matter what I think since I don't run games for you... in a nutshell all I was saying was if a player comes to me with a sorcerer but then says they want access to specific wizard spells that they will pick as they go along... I might be a little hesitant to just allow that. I gave my reasoning and you honestly may not feel it's good reasoning but then again I don't think the reasons you've given for turning down every possible non-homebrew & homebrew method for attaining what you want are really in the spirit of working together with the DM to make a better game for everyone. This isn't 3e or 4e but it isn't impossible to get the spells you want, you just don't like the method 5e uses to grant them to you (which is fair because some felt the same way about 4e and/or 3e's methods)... As a DM I am always going to lean towards using the rules to grant a player what they are trying to achieve and I am going to expect them to work with me in that aspect not fight against it at every point.</p><p> </p><p>As to your point above... it still isn't addressing my point. What spell at this level is an alternate to Rope Trick or Find Familiar? As it stands right now in the game those are spells the Wizard brings to a party that's unique to the wizard and allows him to do unique things. However you want access to that and numerous other spells... why do you not think being granted that (without some type of trade-off) would be stepping on the wizard's toes? </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No worries...</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>So who picks up your combat slack in the game? 5e stresses the 3 pillars so you are expected to participate and have resources for combat... with you missing any, who takes up the slack and how do you know they want to? </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>So like I told @<em><strong><u><a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=42582" target="_blank">pemerton</a></u></strong></em> earlier in the thread... much more than just Rope Trick, As a DM I would have to think through how spell points/metamagic interact with these different spells before granting them? And even after that if there's a wizard in the party you are stepping on his toes. Honestly I would much rather we work through a home brewed innate casting Wizard than have to vet all these spells, have someone else make up for your lack of combat spells and have you potentially stepping on the toes of anyone in the game who plays a wizard. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I'm going to disagree here and assume that anything in an optimizing guide that's rated gold and specifically called out as overpowered... is overpowered. The fact that a single subclass can be everything you listed above kind of speaks to this IMO.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Imaro, post: 6881782, member: 48965"] Look @[I][B][U][URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=6689464"]MoonSong[/URL][/U][/B][/I] it honestly doesn't matter what I think since I don't run games for you... in a nutshell all I was saying was if a player comes to me with a sorcerer but then says they want access to specific wizard spells that they will pick as they go along... I might be a little hesitant to just allow that. I gave my reasoning and you honestly may not feel it's good reasoning but then again I don't think the reasons you've given for turning down every possible non-homebrew & homebrew method for attaining what you want are really in the spirit of working together with the DM to make a better game for everyone. This isn't 3e or 4e but it isn't impossible to get the spells you want, you just don't like the method 5e uses to grant them to you (which is fair because some felt the same way about 4e and/or 3e's methods)... As a DM I am always going to lean towards using the rules to grant a player what they are trying to achieve and I am going to expect them to work with me in that aspect not fight against it at every point. As to your point above... it still isn't addressing my point. What spell at this level is an alternate to Rope Trick or Find Familiar? As it stands right now in the game those are spells the Wizard brings to a party that's unique to the wizard and allows him to do unique things. However you want access to that and numerous other spells... why do you not think being granted that (without some type of trade-off) would be stepping on the wizard's toes? No worries... So who picks up your combat slack in the game? 5e stresses the 3 pillars so you are expected to participate and have resources for combat... with you missing any, who takes up the slack and how do you know they want to? So like I told @[I][B][U][URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=42582"]pemerton[/URL][/U][/B][/I] earlier in the thread... much more than just Rope Trick, As a DM I would have to think through how spell points/metamagic interact with these different spells before granting them? And even after that if there's a wizard in the party you are stepping on his toes. Honestly I would much rather we work through a home brewed innate casting Wizard than have to vet all these spells, have someone else make up for your lack of combat spells and have you potentially stepping on the toes of anyone in the game who plays a wizard. I'm going to disagree here and assume that anything in an optimizing guide that's rated gold and specifically called out as overpowered... is overpowered. The fact that a single subclass can be everything you listed above kind of speaks to this IMO. [/QUOTE]
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