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Message: <blockquote data-quote="MarauderX" data-source="post: 636649" data-attributes="member: 9990">I think I agree with you for the most part, Plane, about having experience far outweigh natural ability.  The only problem with that has already been stated, in that the same level character will have the same DC, making all wizards 'the same'.  If you did take out the INT modifier, wizards would still decide to increase their INT anyway, if not for bonuses in skills, then for the extra spells at least.  However, I cannot see why extra ability should not be used when it definitely applies, and to do so would be akin to removing DEX from a Reflex save.I would be agreeable to some combination of the above, such as 10+ INT mod + Spell Level/2 + Caster Level/2Round each of the 1/2 items up before adding up the total.  With the above the range ends up being from 13 to about 31, depending on all of the INT modifiers.  A good arguement can be made to include all of the items, and it would be rather hard to ignore any of them, in my opinion.Having spellcraft involved is also a valid point, but to me it doesn't deal with spellcasting directly, but only with identification, effects, etc.</blockquote>