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<blockquote data-quote="mkletch" data-source="post: 481330" data-attributes="member: 3396">It was IceBear's estimation that I was using 'real life', but what other example do you want?&nbsp; We are working in an area that some people feel is unclear within the rules.Some other posters have laid out logical arguments, quoting sections of the rules, and demonstrating how they interlock to say &quot;AoOs while unarmed are OK&quot;.Yet others have simply decried these logical presentations, calling names, ranting and raving, but not offering anything useful in return.&nbsp; These are the posts that are without value.So, it comes to this one, minor question: Bow or reach weapon, can you AoO unarmed.&nbsp; There is disagreement (it is a discussion board afterall), and could go either way.&nbsp; The fact that the Sage has blatantly contradicted the core rules (which you agree with) makes his other pronouncements on this subject questionable.&nbsp; Are these rulings based on core or non-core/non-official material?&nbsp; As for the intent of the rules, that is a dangerous area to tread upon.&nbsp; Either it is clearly stated, or it is not.&nbsp; If it is not clearly stated, then any arguments based upon that are without value.There is no section of rules that deals with weapons being ready or not ready for use, so that is discarded as irrelevant.&nbsp; If I am not going to use the bow or longspear, I do not need two hands.&nbsp; That means I have a hand free.&nbsp; If I can make an AoO when unarmed, and I have a hand that is unarmed, I can make an attack with that.As for rules intent, it is largely irrlevant in this case (or any other).&nbsp; For most characters, they are better off skipping the unarmed AoO unless in truly desperate straits.&nbsp; Only a few rare cases (fighters that have specialized in unarmed combat for some reason, and of course monks) really matter.&nbsp; If the archer, sorcerer w/ crossbow or longspearman wishes to make an unarmed AoO, more power to them.&nbsp; The return AoO for the untrained unarmed strike is likely to cost more than they got in return.I'll try.&nbsp; You too.-Fletch!</blockquote>

[QUOTE="mkletch, post: 481330, member: 3396"] It was IceBear's estimation that I was using 'real life', but what other example do you want? We are working in an area that some people feel is unclear within the rules. Some other posters have laid out logical arguments, quoting sections of the rules, and demonstrating how they interlock to say "AoOs while unarmed are OK". Yet others have simply decried these logical presentations, calling names, ranting and raving, but not offering anything useful in return. These are the posts that are without value. So, it comes to this one, minor question: Bow or reach weapon, can you AoO unarmed. There is disagreement (it is a [i]discussion[/i] board afterall), and could go either way. The fact that the Sage has blatantly contradicted the core rules (which you agree with) makes his other pronouncements on this subject questionable. Are these rulings based on core or non-core/non-official material? As for the intent of the rules, that is a dangerous area to tread upon. Either it is clearly stated, or it is not. If it is not clearly stated, then any arguments based upon that are without value. There is no section of rules that deals with weapons being ready or not ready for use, so that is discarded as irrelevant. If I am not going to use the bow or longspear, I do not need two hands. That means I have a hand free. If I can make an AoO when unarmed, and I have a hand that is unarmed, I can make an attack with that. As for rules intent, it is largely irrlevant in this case (or any other). For most characters, they are better off skipping the unarmed AoO unless in truly desperate straits. Only a few rare cases (fighters that have specialized in unarmed combat for some reason, and of course monks) really matter. If the archer, sorcerer w/ crossbow or longspearman wishes to make an unarmed AoO, more power to them. The return AoO for the untrained unarmed strike is likely to cost more than they got in return. I'll try. You too. -Fletch! [/QUOTE]

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