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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 9881037" data-attributes="member: 4937">It has to do with the fact that the way bonuses to surprise are defined, they are defined not as modifiers but as dice rolls.  Typically, you see very stealthy and alert things defined by the dice that they use or impose on others.  And that works fine if but one side is imposing a dice, but if both sides define a variant dice, it is far from obvious how to make the adjustments.  My rules say I use one dice, but your rules say I use some other dice while my rules also say you should use some dice while your rules say you should use a different dice.  There are ways to make it work out, but try reading a modern document on how to run surprise and initiative in 1e AD&D in the general case.These are specific instances of 1e AD&D not having a unified system and instead defining the system in place without reference to how anywhere else defines the rules.And again, try reading the collected rules on initiative when all the various point definitions of how the exception based system is modified are incorporated together.</blockquote>