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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mad Hamish" data-source="post: 5692769" data-attributes="member: 25321">Not having played a lot of pathfinder yet this is a bit of theorycraft but I think it's pretty reasonable, although some classes require more optimisation than others and they can all be wrecked by bad builds...(not in order in tiers)1st tierWizard, Cleric2nd tier Sorceror, Druid, Oracle3rd Bard,Inquisitor4th tier Ranger, Barbarian, Fighter, Alchemist, Paladin4th tier Monk, Rogue(not rated Summoner, Magus, Gunslinger, Ninja, witch, cavalier, samurai, anti-paladin)Wizards and clerics are the flexible, full casting classes and clerics still have a fair amount of hth and self buffing potential. The range of spells they have and options they have to change them daily makes them unmatched IMO Druids I don't think have quite the same flexibility in their spell lists so I see them as a bit behind but I could well be wrong as I haven't seen one in play.Sorcerors & Oracles have the restricted list of known spells but have more spells per day, not as flexible but commonly still up there.Bard and Inquisitor have a balance of spells, buff and self buff abilities that make them flexible, typically they're both pretty useful in social and skill situations as well.  Ranger, Barbarian, Fighter, Alchemist, Paladin all have strengths and weaknesses (and the alchemist could go up or down a tier pretty easily not having seen one in play)The rest of the ones in the tier are combat based and all do that well, the fighter has a large range of tricks they can add with their feats, the paladin has a lot of defensive ability and some large offensive boosts (smite evil, bond to weapon), the ranger has a fair amount of skill support and favoured enemies can be huge. The barbarian's rage and rage powers give them a fair bit.The monk and rogue are worse in combat than the previous tiers and the skills of a rogue don't really make up for it, nor do the monk abilities & defences make up for the lack of offence or flexibility with power.(Ninja is probably around here, might move up to the previous tier)(Magus is probably low 2 or 3)Summoner and Gunslinger I'm not sure about. I've seen a level 13 character who was largely a gunslinger in action for a session and it was powerful but it had a few levels of rogue a revolver and I don't think it would have stayed as effective given a bit of time for the GM to figure it out.Summoner I haven't figured out yet. It's probably 2nd, maybe 3rd.The other classes cavalier, witch, samurai & anti-paladin I haven't looked at I will say that I think any class is playable and capable of having fun with and how well a party works together and how much other characters are willing to do to help out can make a huge impact on effectiveness (a buffing wizard can make a rogue very powerful once he has greater invisibility for instance) but I'd expect that getting a straight rogue or monk to be effective requires a lot more work than other characters. I think the traditional power breakdown of full casters, partial casters, non-casters is still pretty close.Of course that's dependent on a 'standard' campaign. In a low combat espionage based campaign then the fighter would be less useful (as would the paladin & barbarian) and the rogue and ninja would probably go up and a sorceror who focused on blast spells wouldn't be that much use...</blockquote>

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