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Message: <blockquote data-quote="TiQuinn" data-source="post: 321272" data-attributes="member: 4871">I think it comes down to how people perceive D&D and what they expect out of it.  Just as many people are drawn to a story as they are to the combat aspects of the game.  Whether it was 1e or 2e or 3e, there have always been "munchkins"...folks who want to use the rules to their advantage to make their characters as strong as possible.  Sometimes it's a phase that people go through.  I know quite a number of players who swore off min-maxing when they realized that, in the end, it's disruptive to the game.  The DM needs to consistently challenge the players, and min-maxing tends to make the game more of a Player Vs. DM scenario.  Eventually, people get bored of it.Sometimes it's just a matter of the DM not providing enough roleplaying or story for the players.  It happens.  It happened to me and my friends pointed it out.  Yeah, that's a little bit of an ego crusher, but sometimes the players will go with whatever the DM provides them.  Provide them a great story, they'll get into it as roleplayers.  Give them a hack and slash with little story, all that's left for players is making their characters the best they can be by using rules to their advantage.  I'm not saying it always works this way, but I think it happens quite a bit, and not a lot of DMs are willing to admit this either.Finally folks may revel in "munchkinism"!  And more power to them!  If that's the style they enjoy, who am I to say it's wrong?  But if the DM doesn't like that style of play, then they should consider letting someone else DM or find another group (depending on the circumstances).  DMing should not be a chore, and if you are having zero fun, then it's time for someone else to step up to the plate and let you have some fun as a player instead.</blockquote>

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