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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Willie the Duck" data-source="post: 9757344" data-attributes="member: 6799660">I suspect the point is that the Monk, overall (throughout editions) is a dog's breakfast of tropes about martial artists. Also that it is still wedded to a version of that concept dreamed up by Brian Blume in 1975 with a lot of celestial cattle-ness about it that it can't shake.To the former, the 2024 version has tried to shake off the 'inherent orientalism' tropes while still letting the people who want to play them as Remo Williams/ Kwai Chang Caine. It is arguable if they've succeeded. To the later, well, it's still a high speed 'martial' class with lower hp, likely AC, and consistent damage output than a fighter that in exchange gets a bunch of situational perks and x/day-style benefits. I'd say what a 2024 monk can do with  bonus action abilities and focus points are a lot more consistently usable than  what they got in 1975 (or 2001) like being able to take less damage from falls -- if and only if you were next to a wall-- and the like.So anyways, yeah the class both thematically and mechanically is still fighting to carve out a (specific) niche, but it does so a lot better than before. I can certainly understand reasonable people disagreeing on whether it has succeeded.</blockquote>