Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 5520983" data-attributes="member: 87792">Depends - are you looking at top tier or lower tier.&nbsp; Because the strongest characters when the PHB came out are stronger than anything walking around now.&nbsp; Orbizards?&nbsp; Pre-errata Stormwardens with Infinite Blade Cascade?&nbsp; Even fighters have taken a few nerfs.&nbsp; The top tier has actually been pushed back, with the goal of getting as wide a second tier as possible.&nbsp;&nbsp;What you describe is one level out from where I'm talking.&nbsp; GURPS Tactics generally are in setting up the fight rather than within the fight itself.&nbsp; And my 4E group is doing that quite nicely to my bandit fort - they are terrorizing rather than attacking it (38 on Intimidate at the end of a long RP setup really helped).&nbsp;&nbsp;Which is what the 4e forced movement is meant to represent in a larger than life manner.&nbsp; Hell, Tide of Iron is how I fight with large shield.&nbsp; Covering fire isn't so strong in 4e - gun tactics aren't included.&nbsp;&nbsp;Agreed.&nbsp; And on both Orcus and Gondolas.&nbsp;&nbsp;And I dislike this.&nbsp; Because it leads to &quot;Knuckles-23 just got arbitrarily killed.&nbsp; Oh well.&nbsp; Here's Knuckles-24&quot;.&nbsp; If I've invested into a character, I don't like them getting wiped out at random.&nbsp; It makes me feel robbed - whereas if I fell because things broke badly despite being significantly in my control I don't mind it.&nbsp; AD&amp;D fights feel too much like Russian Roulette to me.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Neonchameleon, post: 5520983, member: 87792"] Depends - are you looking at top tier or lower tier. Because the strongest characters when the PHB came out are stronger than anything walking around now. Orbizards? Pre-errata Stormwardens with Infinite Blade Cascade? Even fighters have taken a few nerfs. The top tier has actually been pushed back, with the goal of getting as wide a second tier as possible. What you describe is one level out from where I'm talking. GURPS Tactics generally are in setting up the fight rather than within the fight itself. And my 4E group is doing that quite nicely to my bandit fort - they are terrorizing rather than attacking it (38 on Intimidate at the end of a long RP setup really helped). Which is what the 4e forced movement is meant to represent in a larger than life manner. Hell, Tide of Iron is how I fight with large shield. Covering fire isn't so strong in 4e - gun tactics aren't included. Agreed. And on both Orcus and Gondolas. And I dislike this. Because it leads to "Knuckles-23 just got arbitrarily killed. Oh well. Here's Knuckles-24". If I've invested into a character, I don't like them getting wiped out at random. It makes me feel robbed - whereas if I fell because things broke badly [I]despite being significantly in my control[/I] I don't mind it. AD&D fights feel too much like Russian Roulette to me. [/QUOTE]

Verification