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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Saeviomagy" data-source="post: 5284733" data-attributes="member: 5890">The strength based builds have no issues getting CA at range. I don't understand why you think they do. Their toolbox for gaining CA is pretty much identical with the exception of the int-based build's super-stealth.I really don't know where you're going here.Avenger stands next to foe. Foe double moves away. Avenger gains OA (which sucks because his MBA sucks), moves, then charges (which also sucks, because his MBA sucks).l2adhominem!The nerf? Well, some parties are going to lose a not-insignificant amount of damage, but it's not the nerf that's an issue in my mind: it's that the nerf is being developed to counter a feat developed to counter an issue with roughly half the melee classes.Doesn't do as much damage as what? As of right now, most strikers aren't able to get their damage boosts on granted basic attacks. If it weren't for the fact that any melee class with strength is automatically better with granted attacks than any melee class without it, then it would be a roughly even field. Right now: give it to the guy with strength, regardless of his role or weapon.The effect of melee training for a monk or assassin is:1. OAs. They do matter. If your foes know your OA is unlikely to hit, and will do rubbish damage even if it does, then they are much more likely to move away from you.2. Charges. An at-will that basically says "move your speed and attack with +1 to hit" is pretty good when you get it for free. Missing out on it will make a difference (for starters, reference what I said about foes being able to simply double move away from you with little risk)3. Granted attacks. The striker role is supposed to be about dealing damage. So why is the fighter the prime choice for granted attacks over every other class in the game?If you think that OAs, maneuverability and the ability to have your powers work when you choose a warlord are minor issues, then please, feel free to leave this discussion. It's obvious that you believe that the impact of melee training is slight, and that if anything it's a terrible feat for anyone to choose. In which case, why do you feel the need to argue that it needs to be worse/removed from the game?</blockquote>

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