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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 8598905" data-attributes="member: 42582">I'm just puzzled by what the intentionality is that you (and [USER=71699]@clearstream[/USER]?) are referring to.If it's Harguld's intention to shoot the gnoll, the concept of action seems to cover all the ground that we need. As you say, the process looks the same if action is the operative notion.And if it's Dro's intention, then that's real and not fictional.And just to be clear - given that I feel you're something of an innocent bystander in this exchange who's taking fire from entrenched positions you didn't even know were there! - there is a hill I'm defending. Which is that the use of a Trait, in Torchbearer, is not fiction-first. And the reason I'm defending that hill is because the difference between Torchbearer and DungeonWorld is a real one. And if we want to have good play experiences in TB, and good play experiences in DW, we should keep that in mind. DW is "if you do it, you do it". TB isn't. That's part of what opens up TB to skilful play in ways that are different from DW. Not all skilful play in TB is skilful play of the fiction. Quite a bit of it is skilful play of "meta"-resources, like Traits. (I'll [USER=6696971]@Manbearcat[/USER] on this point, in case he has any thoughts to share.)</blockquote>