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Message: <blockquote data-quote="iserith" data-source="post: 7616136" data-attributes="member: 97077">While I agree that torture is far too common in many games, I don't agree with your reasoning on the mechanics encouraging it or your solutions for curtailing it.Your position on the mechanics seems to be one in which the players are asking for or declaring that they are making ability checks, which the rules do not allow. The DM is always the one who asks for ability checks, when the outcome of the task has an uncertain outcome and a meaningful consequence for failure. So even if the players set about torturing someone, the DM decides in all cases whether there is a roll, not the players. Thus, the DM can simply say the torture doesn't produce any useful results, no roll.It's helpful to examine the reason this is such a common trope in D&D and I would suggest it's because of meaningless fights and a lack of information. The players, faced with a fight with intelligent enemies, might rightly assume there's a good reason for the battle and that the motivation for trying to kill their characters is useful information. Someone sent them, for example, or they are part of a hidden plot the players assume must be uncovered to get to the next plot point. This information is not revealed in the fight and so they keep that one poor sap alive to work him or her over after the battle is done.So, what's a DM to do? Well, I would suggest that the DM share information more freely. The PCs' assailants might announce their motivations right out of the gate e.g. "This is for sticking your nose where it don't belong - the Black Spider will not be stopped!" Then have them smacktalk and drop information throughout the fight. Alternatively, anyone who surrenders can just give up the info after the defeat, not wanting any further trouble. Other clues in the fight might also be useful, such as the kinds of weapons the enemies use or markings on their gear. Someone might have a diary or a letter that provides the necessary information. And so on.Ultimately, I put this issue on the DM more than I do the players. Many DMs like to hide their plots so well that players see torture as a tool they can use to uncover the plot. And many DMs forget that it is they, not the players, who decide when dice are rolled. Bearing these two things in mind, torture is easily taken off the table as a necessary or viable path to getting the information the players need to continue with the plot.</blockquote>

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