Totally Lost on Wildshape... Please Help

[JesterPoet]

Okay, I'm totally lost as far as the rules for Wildshaping. I get the basics:

- Times per day
- standard action, no AOO, etc
- Hit dice restriction
- size/level limitations
- Etc.

I'm going to try to list the things that I don't understand. If someone could give me a rundown, so I can effectively use my druid, that would be wonderful.

1) First off, what I don't get are the stat changes. From what I can tell, you take the physical stats and keep the mental. This would mean that your hit points change. I guess that makes sense... just apply the con change to your hitpoints. But since your hit die type doesn't change (unless I'm wrong, and let me know if I am) and your con bonus may have (if you've been adding points to con) it seems to be a pain in the ass to do that, though I guess you could keep a running total of how many points your con bonus added over time. Is this what most people do?

However, I was looking at the rules of the game section on polymorph, specifically at the example where Anlion (example character) polymorphs into a lizardman

According to their example, his AC goes from a 14 to a 17, though his dex goes down and he only seems to gain a natural armor bonus of +5. What am I missing? How do I determine my character's armor class when I wildshape?

2) Forms are the other things that confuse me. I see all kinds of people talking about wildshaping into polar bears and legendary this and that as they go up in levels. Aren't you required to have interacted directly with what you want to polymorph into? Or did I miss something?

3) Attacking. You gain the number and type of attacks of the animal, but you keep your base attack bonus. So, if I have a bonus of +6/+1 at 8th level, and I am a brown bear making a full attack, how does that work? Assuming the bear gets claw/claw/bite, do I only get claw/bite or claw/claw and have to take the third at a negative? Or do I get claw/claw/bite at +6 (plus the bear's strength modifier). I can't imagaine I could possibly get claw/claw/bite twice (once at +6 and then again at +1).

4) Loss of ex. vision modes is BS. You should get what you turn into. This, however, isn't a question. More of a useless rant, really.

So... if someone could help me sort all this stuff out, that'd be great. If I am making an assumption that is wrong, by all means, correct me. I just want to do this right.

Man, there really needs to be a "guide to wildshaping." Between the books and the SRD and "Rules of the Game" I think it's just too confusing.

 

[DanMcS]

1) First off, what I don't get are the stat changes. From what I can tell, you take the physical stats and keep the mental. This would mean that your hit points change. I guess that makes sense... just apply the con change to your hitpoints. But since your hit die type doesn't change (unless I'm wrong, and let me know if I am) and your con bonus may have (if you've been adding points to con) it seems to be a pain in the ass to do that, though I guess you could keep a running total of how many points your con bonus added over time. Is this what most people do?

Your con bonus to hit points is always con bonus * level. If you're a 10th level druid with a 12 con, you have 10 hit points from con, and maybe 55 total (45 you rolled + 10 from con). If you wildshape into something with a 16 con (+3), your hit points from con go to 3*10, and your total hit points to 75. Be careful when you shift back, because shifting back to a form with lower max hit points can kill you if you've taken enough damage.

However, I was looking at the rules of the game section on polymorph, specifically at the example where Anlion (example character) polymorphs into a lizardman

According to their example, his AC goes from a 14 to a 17, though his dex goes down and he only seems to gain a natural armor bonus of +5. What am I missing? How do I determine my character's armor class when I wildshape?

He had a ring of protection +1, bracers of armor +1, gained 5 points of natural armor, and went down to no dex bonus, hence AC 17.

When you wildshape, you generally don't get to keep items active unless they can be worn by your new form, I think. For instance, armor is generally a no-no.

2) Forms are the other things that confuse me. I see all kinds of people talking about wildshaping into polar bears and legendary this and that as they go up in levels. Aren't you required to have interacted directly with what you want to polymorph into? Or did I miss something?

Knowledge- nature or arcana or whatever can give you knowledge of critters. Enough to assume their form without having seen them directly? Maybe, it's up to the DM really.

3) Attacking. You gain the number and type of attacks of the animal, but you keep your base attack bonus. So, if I have a bonus of +6/+1 at 8th level, and I am a brown bear making a full attack, how does that work? Assuming the bear gets claw/claw/bite, do I only get claw/bite or claw/claw and have to take the third at a negative? Or do I get claw/claw/bite at +6 (plus the bear's strength modifier). I can't imagaine I could possibly get claw/claw/bite twice (once at +6 and then again at +1).

Natural attack routines generally don't get extra attacks from high BAB. You'd get claw/claw/bite using your BAB (+6) and the bear's strength as the base for it. The bite is usually the primary attack, the claws are probably both at -2. If the bear has a +5 strength bonus, you'd get bite (+11), claw (+9), claw (+9).

Edit: I think you could also just attack with a single claw and get that extra BAB attack, at like +11/+6, if you wanted, but you're usually better off with the natural attack routine.

4) Loss of ex. vision modes is BS. You should get what you turn into. This, however, isn't a question. More of a useless rant, really.

Swell . Do it that way in your game. We do, it doesn't hurt anything.

 

[Urbanmech]

Don't look at the stat blocks from the Rules of the Game article. There are a few contradictions and errors there.

1. If you turn into a black bear you would replace your physical stats with: 19 str, 13 dex, and 15 con. In 3.5 when your con changes in polymorph, wild shape or shapechange you change your hp. Be careful with small forms though very few animals have Con's below 10.

2. Up to the DM what you have seen. But druids can really get around so it shoudn't be too hard to use your down time searching for and observing animals.

3. You gain the animals attack modes. So if you turn into a bear you gain 2 claws at your BAB plus Str (minus any size penalities) and a bite at your BAB plus Str minus 5 unless you have the multiattack feat. If you turn into a giant octopus you would gain 8 arm attacks at your BAB plus Str and one bite at BAB plus Str minus 5 (for being a secondary attack)

4. I agree with you whole heartedly. You gain the ability to fly and grow feathers as a bird why can't your eyes now enable you to see better in the dark? The worst offenders of the noncombat abilities are not gained are blindsense/sight (dolphin, dire bat) or holding your breath (dolphin, crocodile). Plus turning into a plant and not gaining all of the plants immunities is a little silly.

Good luck

 

[Hypersmurf]

Be careful with small forms though very few animals have Con's below 10.

From memory, the only creatures in the Monster Manual with negative Con racial adjustments are elves and kobolds... and they use a Warrior stat array that puts a higher base value in Con, so even they come out with a 10.

-Hyp.

 

[Urbanmech]

You are a font of knowledge Hypersmurf! I wasn't sure if any animals like a bat, rat, or cat would have a con lower than 10 so I was hedging by saying very few. Looks like there are none. But it is still something to worry about if you go from a 19 Con brown bear to a 12 Con eagle, minimum of 16 hp lost there.