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<blockquote data-quote="Hypersmurf" data-source="post: 1437245" data-attributes="member: 1656">Well, sure.&nbsp; That's like the wizard putting all his points in Int, leaving his Str at 8, and then carrying around 400 pounds of gear while conveniently forgetting that he can't lift it.There's a difference between min/maxing, and --/maxing.&nbsp; You can attempt to minimise your disadvantages, but if you instead simply ignore your disadvantages, you are cheating.But the guy you're describing wasn't a jerk because he was a mix/maxer.&nbsp; He was a jerk who happened to also be a min/maxer.If you once met an obnoxious creep who wore a purple neckscarf, it doesn't automatically follow that everyone you meet in a purple neckscarf will be an obnoxious creep.&nbsp; There may actually be a statistical correlation - I don't know if anyone's ever done a study - but it's not a one-to-one correspondence.As you noted, your roommate is a min/maxer who isn't a jerk.&nbsp; So it's not guaranteed that everyone who min/maxes is going to destroy a game.&nbsp; Your player above did that through his ignoring what was written on his sheet in the case of his fighter, and through being obnoxious in the case of his wizard.&nbsp; He didn't deliberately set out to create a character with a better Know:Rel modifier than the cleric, so it wasn't a min/maxing problem.&nbsp; It was how he behaved once he realised that caused the trouble.-Hyp.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Hypersmurf, post: 1437245, member: 1656"] Well, sure. That's like the wizard putting all his points in Int, leaving his Str at 8, and then carrying around 400 pounds of gear while conveniently forgetting that he can't lift it. There's a difference between min/maxing, and --/maxing. You can attempt to minimise your disadvantages, but if you instead simply ignore your disadvantages, you [i]are[/i] cheating. But the guy you're describing wasn't a jerk [i]because[/i] he was a mix/maxer. He was a jerk who happened to also be a min/maxer. If you once met an obnoxious creep who wore a purple neckscarf, it doesn't automatically follow that everyone you meet in a purple neckscarf will be an obnoxious creep. There may actually be a statistical correlation - I don't know if anyone's ever done a study - but it's not a one-to-one correspondence. As you noted, your roommate is a min/maxer who [i]isn't[/i] a jerk. So it's not guaranteed that everyone who min/maxes is going to destroy a game. Your player above did that through his ignoring what was written on his sheet in the case of his fighter, and through being obnoxious in the case of his wizard. He didn't deliberately set out to create a character with a better Know:Rel modifier than the cleric, so it wasn't a min/maxing problem. It was how he behaved once he realised that caused the trouble. -Hyp. [/QUOTE]

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