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Message: <blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 4658635" data-attributes="member: 2011">I'm not too keen on the knock prone rule. It shouts to the players MINION (which is also something I do not like about how the core rules can be used).For me, the problem is not just that they are so easy to kill, but also that the PCs are quickly given meta-gaming information that a foe is a minion and hence, they change their tactics accordingly.I dislike the concept of minions with the word Minion stamped on their foreheads.I use a tough minion system of:When a tough minion fight starts, secretly roll a single die. Even result means even kills tough minion. Odd means odd.When a PC hits a tough minion and his total to hit is even and the random roll was even, the minion dies in one shot.When a PC hits a tough minion and his total to hit is even and the random roll was odd, the minion is hurt.A tough minion can take 2 such shots before being killed on the 3rd. If it is hit a second time and is not killed, it is bloodied.So, a 50% chance of killing a minion on the first hit. A 25% chance of killing a minion on the second hit. And, a 25% chance of bloodying the minion on the second hit and killing it on the third hit.I also have the tough minions roll dice for their attack damage and I double the XP for tough minions.The advantages of this system are:1) The players are not sure whether a given foe is a minion or not early on, maybe even not for the entire encounter.2) Minions are not always cardboard opponents easily taken out with area effects.Note: Do not tell your players how you are running this. It can also be done even/odd D20 result, even/odd damage for non-AoEs, etc. And, the DM can mix up encounters with minions, or tough minions, or a combo of both (along with other monsters). But, mix the system up from encounter to encounter so that the players have a difficult time of figuring out how it works.Now, people might state that this takes a very minor amount of bookkeeping. If the minion was hit once and not killed, yes the DM has to make a mark next to the minion's name on his monster sheet (or whatever he uses) to indicate that the minion was hit once. The bloodied indicator on the board indicates that it was hit twice and not killed.</blockquote>

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