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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 8345291" data-attributes="member: 42582">Are you talking about commercial development of the idea, especially via TSR? Then perhaps yes.Are you just talking about the idea itself? Then I think no. In the late 70s Lewis Pulsipher, writing in White Dwarf, was already distinguishing between D&amp;D played as a wargame and D&amp;D played as a &quot;novel&quot;.(EDIT: I've finished reading the thread, and see [USER=7030755]@Malmuria[/USER] and [USER=7026594]@Mannahnin[/USER] have made similar points.)I don't agree re 4e D&amp;D. 4e is the closest D&amp;D has come to integrating &quot;indie&quot; design techniques into D&amp;D - closed scene resolution for non-combat (skill challenges) as well as combat; player-authored quests; a focus on conflict as the driver of play (&quot;skip to the fun&quot;; scene-based resolution with the encounter-power and heaing paradigm); separating PC advancement from meeting requirements/tasks set by the GM (XP awarded based merely on playing, especially post-DMG 2; treasure awarded via a per-level parcel system).And those indie techniques are a direct reaction to Hickman-style design, although more in its White Wolf form than in its second-half-of-the-1980s D&amp;D form.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 8345291, member: 42582"] Are you talking about commercial development of the idea, especially via TSR? Then perhaps yes. Are you just talking about the idea itself? Then I think no. In the late 70s Lewis Pulsipher, writing in White Dwarf, was already distinguishing between D&D played as a wargame and D&D played as a "novel". (EDIT: I've finished reading the thread, and see [USER=7030755]@Malmuria[/USER] and [USER=7026594]@Mannahnin[/USER] have made similar points.) I don't agree re 4e D&D. 4e is the closest D&D has come to integrating "indie" design techniques into D&D - closed scene resolution for non-combat (skill challenges) as well as combat; player-authored quests; a focus on conflict as the driver of play ("skip to the fun"; scene-based resolution with the encounter-power and heaing paradigm); separating PC advancement from meeting requirements/tasks set by the GM (XP awarded based merely on playing, especially post-DMG 2; treasure awarded via a per-level parcel system). And those indie techniques are a direct reaction to Hickman-style design, although more in its White Wolf form than in its second-half-of-the-1980s D&D form. [/QUOTE]

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