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<blockquote data-quote="Slobber Monster" data-source="post: 2449536" data-attributes="member: 27687"><p>I agree with what others have said - this is a problem of adventure and encounter design, not a rules problem. If a trap is in an obvious place, and there is no time pressure, then I don't think there should be any challenge in finding it for a group which includes a good trap finder. I could kinda live with the variable take 20 idea, but I don't really see how it makes things any more fun for anyone, except maybe the DM who just wants to see traps go off. As a DM I don't really get that either - oh you step there, roll some dice, you take damage, get cured. Ho hum.</p><p></p><p>I think adventures in general have to include some element of time pressure in order to be well balanced and interesting. The old school way to do it is with random encounters - which still works fine at lower levels as long as it makes sense for the environment. Taking 20 on every search suddenly looks a lot less attractive if a marauding band of ghouls shows up every half hour or so.</p><p></p><p>Random encounters don't work as well for this purpose as PC's get to higher levels, since they have access to magic which all but guarantees a restful sleep. But there are still plenty of scenarios left which enforce time pressure and can still be mixed with a dungeon crawl - race against the clock, pursuit, espionage, and assaulting an active defense immediately come to mind.</p><p></p><p>Lastly, combining traps with creatures who are aware of the trap is probably my favorite. It tends to make all kinds of skills useful in combat - search, disable device, jump, tumble, balance all have potential use if there's a nasty trap that must be skirted or disabled to reach the enemy.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Slobber Monster, post: 2449536, member: 27687"] I agree with what others have said - this is a problem of adventure and encounter design, not a rules problem. If a trap is in an obvious place, and there is no time pressure, then I don't think there should be any challenge in finding it for a group which includes a good trap finder. I could kinda live with the variable take 20 idea, but I don't really see how it makes things any more fun for anyone, except maybe the DM who just wants to see traps go off. As a DM I don't really get that either - oh you step there, roll some dice, you take damage, get cured. Ho hum. I think adventures in general have to include some element of time pressure in order to be well balanced and interesting. The old school way to do it is with random encounters - which still works fine at lower levels as long as it makes sense for the environment. Taking 20 on every search suddenly looks a lot less attractive if a marauding band of ghouls shows up every half hour or so. Random encounters don't work as well for this purpose as PC's get to higher levels, since they have access to magic which all but guarantees a restful sleep. But there are still plenty of scenarios left which enforce time pressure and can still be mixed with a dungeon crawl - race against the clock, pursuit, espionage, and assaulting an active defense immediately come to mind. Lastly, combining traps with creatures who are aware of the trap is probably my favorite. It tends to make all kinds of skills useful in combat - search, disable device, jump, tumble, balance all have potential use if there's a nasty trap that must be skirted or disabled to reach the enemy. [/QUOTE]
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