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Message: <blockquote data-quote="CapnZapp" data-source="post: 6544413" data-attributes="member: 12731">You keep mixing up facts and ascribing me opinions to support your position. I consider those rules a sorry excuse for a real working system. The crafting rules can be summarized with "it takes too long". The purchasing rules are almost completely random.In fact, I would argue they exist only as a placeholder to protect WotC from complaints about not including any such rules.It's a shame that strategy seems to be working on at least one person.That argument is complete bollocks.Anyone wanting cheaper/more expensive magic can just halve/double any prices regardless.  Yeah, so it's better to start off with almost all items mispriced?When was the potential for making mistakes ever a good reason for not trying?If you hand these out to the players, yes they were. But who says you must do that?Besides, the formulas might be broken, but the preset individual prices for things in the DMG (as opposed to stuff created by players specifically to abuse the system) are still way better than the sloppy randomness that is 5E.You're only parroting the idea from the DMG. Please stop telling me things I already know.Besides, it is a stupid idea. The base price of an item should be based on utility, power and function. The actual asking price might well be modified (quite heavily) by rarity, but that doesn't excuse not having a rational base price to begin with.No, what gave you that crazy idea?Yes exactly. Why not skip the cathedral-building and sword-creating altogether? Why not skip directly to the next adventure?Oh wait, you must have confused me with someone else, since I have been VERY CLEAR I'M DISCUSSING THE NO-DOWNTIME PLAYING STYLE!No, I am not contradictory. You are insulting my intelligence if you really believe that.Let me tell you a secret. Gold, like experience points, are WORTHLESS in itself. Why would you think we want treasure? To sleep on it like a dragon? To eat it like a first edition barbarian?No, the only value in gold/xp is in spending it, in exchanging it for something worthwhile.In your campaign, clearly a cathedral is worthwhile. But in mine, it is useless. Why should the game support your expenditures but not mine, when all previous editions have done so?Sorry but the main value of those rules seems to be to draw out and expose the clueless and the apologists. In that, they seem to be working well...Thanks for that straw man. No, I have no issues with myself.So I guess you advocate a communist society then where everything belongs to everybody, and you don't need money since everything is provided for you?Sorry but that preposterous argument needed what it deserved.But to be exceedingly clear: the point of money is to transfer the purchasing decision from the adventure/DM to the player/character.You gain gold and not stuff because:1) the DM doesn't need to figure out exact items beforehand2) the player gets to choose him or herself3) the risk of getting stuff you can't or won't use is lessened4) the character can focus his abilities in a certain direction, instead of relying on (semi-)random bonus categoriesSorry why are you discussing 3E now?I thought we agreed 5E didn't work this way?I did say any magic item pricing guidelines should be OPTIONAL, didn't I?Why are you still arguing with me? Why are you still denying me the right to enjoy 5E just as much as you do?Have I promised I would arrive at your house and prevent you from using the <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> random mess of a rule for magic items you seem to cherish so much just because WotC let me purchase a solid replacement?I can't imagine I have, but if so, I deeply apologize and take it all back.</blockquote>

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