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<blockquote data-quote="Majoru Oakheart" data-source="post: 4090805" data-attributes="member: 5143">Or, you know...he could just deal non-lethal in 3rd Edition...or the equivalent in 4th.&nbsp; Which is the way to incapacitate them without killing them.Which also has the side effect of not bypassing hitpoints.&nbsp; &quot;Can't get up from prone&quot; is just bad monster design.&nbsp; It essentially creates an &quot;I win&quot; condition a lot like save or dies or save or suck spells.&nbsp; In these situations it is almost ALWAYS a better idea to go with the bypass solution than it is to just attack.&nbsp; It means that the PCs(or enemies) are playing two different games:1) I attack the enemy and do 20 damage, it has 100 left.2) I trip it, it's on the ground, it can't get up.&nbsp; I win.3) I hit it for 3 con damage, 7 more and it dies.4) I cast Slay Living, it fails and it dies.Without the &quot;I win&quot; condition it instead adds more tension and more interesting combat as the PCs now actually have to avoid the attacks of the monsters for multiple rounds as they slowly chip away at the hitpoints of the enemies.&nbsp; There's very little tension when combat degrades down to &quot;I trip it.&nbsp; That's one down.&nbsp; I trip it.&nbsp; That's 2.&quot;</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Majoru Oakheart, post: 4090805, member: 5143"] Or, you know...he could just deal non-lethal in 3rd Edition...or the equivalent in 4th. Which is the way to incapacitate them without killing them. Which also has the side effect of not bypassing hitpoints. "Can't get up from prone" is just bad monster design. It essentially creates an "I win" condition a lot like save or dies or save or suck spells. In these situations it is almost ALWAYS a better idea to go with the bypass solution than it is to just attack. It means that the PCs(or enemies) are playing two different games: 1) I attack the enemy and do 20 damage, it has 100 left. 2) I trip it, it's on the ground, it can't get up. I win. 3) I hit it for 3 con damage, 7 more and it dies. 4) I cast Slay Living, it fails and it dies. Without the "I win" condition it instead adds more tension and more interesting combat as the PCs now actually have to avoid the attacks of the monsters for multiple rounds as they slowly chip away at the hitpoints of the enemies. There's very little tension when combat degrades down to "I trip it. That's one down. I trip it. That's 2." [/QUOTE]

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