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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Jeff Wilder" data-source="post: 2462795" data-attributes="member: 5122">Sigh.  I guess this is the best I'm going to get.First we'll take the +1.  So the warrior swings with his longsword at +1 (no TWF penalties apply, since he's not "wielding two weapons," which is what Hypersmurf (and presumably you?) claim is what triggers TWF penalties.  He hits, but the goblin doesn't drop.He uses his Quick-Draw feat to draw his shortsword.  He's now wielding two weapons.  What's his modifier to hit with the shortsword?You see where this is going?You see that under Hypersmurf's version of TWF, he gets a free, non-penalty attack with the longsword, and still gets the benefit of TWF?It gets better.  How about if, before he draws the shortsword, he drops the longsword (a free action).  What's his modifier to hit with the shortsword now?  (Remember, he's not wielding two weapons, so under the Hypersmurf version, he has no TWF penalties.)As I said before, this isn't the only way to abuse the incorrect way that Hypersmurf reads these rules.Imagine a guy with a longsword and a ring that shocking grasps with a touch attack.Or a guy with a longsword and IUS.Or, and this is what I'd try to get, if Hypersmurf were my DM, a guy with a bouncing longsword, that returned to his hand at the end of the round.  (Yes, I just made that up, but it would be fun, and there are returning weapons that can give the same "no penalties for my ranged TWF, ever!" effect.)Does this help you see that it isn't the "wielding two weapons" part that is important to whether you're "fighting this way"?  If that's the important part, all of the above tricks -- and I could keep going! -- are perfectly legal.No, "fighting this way" means "accepting the option of attacking with two weapons, and paying the penalties, even if I don't end up using the benefit."</blockquote>

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