Tripping and drowning rules synergy?

[magnusmalkus]

How do tripping and drowning go hand in hand?

I'm reading the entry on the Kelpie in the Fiend Folio, p114 and it says somtehing to the effect that the kelpie is adept at tripping it's opponent in the water so that they are in danger of drowning.

I'da figured that grappling in the water would be more condusive to drowning...

Thoughts?

 

[Starbuck_II]

How do tripping and drowning go hand in hand?

I'm reading the entry on the Kelpie in the Fiend Folio, p114 and it says somtehing to the effect that the kelpie is adept at tripping it's opponent in the water so that they are in danger of drowning.

I'da figured that grappling in the water would be more condusive to drowning...

Thoughts?

Well, Tripping makes you prone.
Drowning requires your head to be in the water till stop holding breath.

Grappling works but you will also be prone so you both start holding breath checks till drown.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

What would simulate one person over another focrcibly holding the first person's head under water? I'd have thought a pin, but not if it means you have to be prone and in the water, too. Granted, it's not the standard depiction of a pin, but it seems to fit best in my mind.

 

[magnusmalkus]

For the kelpie, doing the tripping and stuff... the kelpie does not need to be worrying itself with drowining, I believe it can breathe water being aquatic fey.

 

[Shin Okada]

From SRD,

Tripping a Mounted Opponent: You may make a trip attack against a mounted opponent. The defender may make a Ride check in place of his Dexterity or Strength check. If you succeed, you pull the rider from his mount.

So, against a character mounted on horse or something, Kelpie can drop him down into the water by tripping.

I don't think it is likely to be the original intent of the author, though.

 

[Marred_Bard]

I'da figured that grappling in the water would be more condusive to drowning...[/quote]


The idea is that they become prone in the water, which if it is above their heads (when prone), causes them to make a Con check to hold their breath or immediately begin drowning. The process of holding their heads underwater would mostly be icing on the cake.

That being said, Kelpies were known for dragging people into the deep water and pulling them under, so you could always choose to substitute improved grapple in place of their improved trip.

Mostly this would be in the hands of the DM - for example, they might need swim checks to recover from being tripped/grappled, depending on the depth of water they were threatened with. In heavy armor, it is easy to see how even relatively shallow water (3') could be very dangerous.

 

[Shin Okada]

Aren't Kelpies also known to let the victim ride on them and bring them into deep water?

In that case, maybe a Kelpie can use trip to "dismount" his own rider.