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<blockquote data-quote="surfarcher" data-source="post: 5075077" data-attributes="member: 84774">Ah challenging players.&nbsp; It's your job to train teach them - think of them like children.&nbsp; I haven't read all the responses yet but here's my thoughts...All of this is solvable without houseruling IMHO.Don't make your dungeons static!&nbsp; They might have space for a 5 or 15 or 60 minute rest ebtween encounters.&nbsp; But in most adventures there will rarely be a place where they can rest 6-8 hours uninterrupted.&nbsp; Sometime something is going to patrol along and find them, interrupting their rest. Start of by giving them a couple light hints - a &quot;random&quot; encounter 30-60 minutes into the rest. Then aother the same amount of time after that.Make sure the encounters fit with the flavour of the dungeon, but make the first one something fairly unintelligent (e.g., some wild Dire rats).&nbsp; If they don't get the hint make the second one more intelligent monsters and make sure one of these escapes and raises the alarm.Total defence is a combat Standard Action.&nbsp; In other words anyone using it is putting all of their thoughts and effort into safely defending themselves.Take them for a walk around a room sized area.&nbsp; Now get them to do the same walk in &quot;total defence&quot;.&nbsp; See how slow that is?&nbsp; I suggest reducing movement of all party members to one plus racial bonus if they want to do this.Again, don't make your encounters/dungeons static.&nbsp; I am guessing this won't continue after the monsters start responding realistically to what the PCs are doing.&nbsp; Have the creature run away or scream loudly and non-stop.&nbsp; Both will raise the alarm and bring the whole population of the dungeon down on the PCs heads.&nbsp; A few things you can do...First, match magic items to the receiving character.&nbsp; Award items that are only of benefit to the class/role of the character who gets it.&nbsp; This implicitly reduces this behaviour by reducing the usefulness of swapping.Second, try to fill the PCs same equipment slots.&nbsp; So the Fighter has to take off his +2 Scale Armour to use the Paladin's +1 Plate Armour of whatever.&nbsp; That makes swapping pointless and a waste of time.Lastly, counter metagaming like this with realism!&nbsp; The PC is still there!&nbsp; They don't magically disappear.&nbsp; They don't have those magic items that improve AC, attacks, etc.&nbsp; An ideal squishy for smarter monsters to target.&nbsp; Really this PC will need to be played as-is by the other players to survive, magic items and all.Ah we all have problems with players form time to time.&nbsp; It's your job as DM to see the underlying faults in what metagaming players are doing and counter it subtly.&nbsp; Your responses need to be reasonable yet compelling.&nbsp; And you also have to be unafraid to say &quot;hey I realised that last game xxx wasn't spot on. Instead of the creatures doing yyy they should have done zzz.&quot;Hope that helps!</blockquote>

[QUOTE="surfarcher, post: 5075077, member: 84774"] Ah challenging players. It's your job to train teach them - think of them like children. I haven't read all the responses yet but here's my thoughts... All of this is solvable without houseruling IMHO. Don't make your dungeons static! They might have space for a 5 or 15 or 60 minute rest ebtween encounters. But in most adventures there will rarely be a place where they can rest 6-8 hours uninterrupted. Sometime something is going to patrol along and find them, interrupting their rest. Start of by giving them a couple light hints - a "random" encounter 30-60 minutes into the rest. Then aother the same amount of time after that. Make sure the encounters fit with the flavour of the dungeon, but make the first one something fairly unintelligent (e.g., some wild Dire rats). If they don't get the hint make the second one more intelligent monsters and make sure one of these escapes and raises the alarm. Total defence is a combat Standard Action. In other words anyone using it is putting all of their thoughts and effort into safely defending themselves. Take them for a walk around a room sized area. Now get them to do the same walk in "total defence". See how slow that is? I suggest reducing movement of all party members to one plus racial bonus if they want to do this. Again, don't make your encounters/dungeons static. I am guessing this won't continue after the monsters start responding realistically to what the PCs are doing. Have the creature run away or scream loudly and non-stop. Both will raise the alarm and bring the whole population of the dungeon down on the PCs heads. A few things you can do... First, match magic items to the receiving character. Award items that are only of benefit to the class/role of the character who gets it. This implicitly reduces this behaviour by reducing the usefulness of swapping. Second, try to fill the PCs same equipment slots. So the Fighter has to take off his +2 Scale Armour to use the Paladin's +1 Plate Armour of whatever. That makes swapping pointless and a waste of time. Lastly, counter metagaming like this with realism! The PC is still there! They don't magically disappear. They don't have those magic items that improve AC, attacks, etc. An ideal squishy for smarter monsters to target. Really this PC will need to be played as-is by the other players to survive, magic items and all. Ah we all have problems with players form time to time. It's your job as DM to see the underlying faults in what metagaming players are doing and counter it subtly. Your responses need to be reasonable yet compelling. And you also have to be unafraid to say "hey I realised that last game xxx wasn't spot on. Instead of the creatures doing yyy they should have done zzz." Hope that helps! [/QUOTE]

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