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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Banshee16" data-source="post: 3352860" data-attributes="member: 7883">I'll try working out a few simple examples tonight, and try posting them.  There is still the factor that the base Shapeshift talent can only be used on a willing target.  But if it's being blended with Destroy, and Destroy allows an unwilling target, and Destroy serves as the base effect since it has the higher base DC, then I'd figure that this would also overrule the target of the spell...There must be a way to do it.  The system seems pretty flexible, and the Silver Spike or one of the early books has Croaker threatening another character that he'd have Goblin turn the victim into a toad, so it must be possible.I suspect that the "willing target" aspect and short duration of the base effect is partly because they want to avoid the party spellcaster turning the party fighter into a fire giant for stat bonuses...but that also means you can't turn that enemy fighter into a mule.Someone in a thread months ago had suggested using the "Slay" talent, which is what gave me the idea of using "Destroy" in the first place.Banshee</blockquote>