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Message: <blockquote data-quote="MrMyth" data-source="post: 5733069" data-attributes="member: 61155">Ok, since I guess my last post was a bit too long to respond to any of the points I made directly, I'll try to condense my argument here:  A) Page 59, of the PHB, says that a power can be sustained. The defined result of sustaining the power is simply that by doing so you "keep that power active", and that the specifics of what this entails are told to you in the Sustain entry. We are given 5 examples, some of which demonstrate the Sustain effect being used to make effects persist, and some which do not do so.  B) Page 278, of the PHB, defines how you handle sustainable durations. At no point in the rules does it state that all effects caused by a power are inherent sustainable. Instead, it simply addresses how you handle effects that are sustainable. Again, it emphasizes that "A power’s description indicates what happens when you sustain it or let it lapse." Again, it focuses on the Sustain entry as the place where it defines what is and is not sustained. You have offered no evidence in the rules, anywhere, that would imply that all effects created by a power are inherently sustained by it.  B1) Indeed, we have the existence of multiple powers that do not have effects to even be sustained. (Radiant Pulse and Doom of Delban). You have not offered any reason for why these powers exist if, by your interpretation, the sustain action can never be taken for that.  B2) Additionally, we have powers, both new and old (Curse of the Dark Delirium, Ravenous Shadows, Cast in Stone) whose design inarguably indicates the designers do not expect the effects of that power to automatically persist when the power is sustained.  B3) Similarly, we have the existence of numerous powers whose Sustain entry specifies that sustaining the power causes a zone or aura or the like to persist. However, many of these powers also inflict conditions on enemies as well, and by your interpretation, sustaining the zones/etc will also automatically sustain the other conditions. In some cases, this simply leads to unbalanced powers; in others, it leads to a contradiction in terms of how to handle a duration that, by your claim, is simultaneously sustained and (save ends).  C) Finally, we have the perspective of the designers themselves, as demonstrated by the design of Sustained powers and the errata offered for early Sustained powers. In the vast majority of all cases, an effort has been made to indicate what effect persists when the power is sustained and for how long.  Conclusion:  I have provided direct quotes from the rules and a decent number of examples supporting my point. If you want me to accept your interpretation, all I ask is answers to the following questions:  1) Where in the rules does it explicitly state that when a power is sustained, all effects of that power automatically persist along with it?  2) How do you believe the rules interact for a sustainable power that includes (save ends) effects? 3) How do you explain the existence of powers like Radiant Pulse and Doom of Delban, or more recent powers like Cast in Stone? In short, why should we settle for an interpretation that involves accepting at least half-a-dozen powers as outright broken, and potentially dozens more, depending on your answer to question 2, above?</blockquote>

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