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UA Spell Versatility: A deeper dive
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<blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 7868090" data-attributes="member: 6801228"><p>Also, just as a data point. Last night over at GiTP I ended up doing some work. </p><p></p><p>I went through the PHB and started listing all the Utility spells I could find. Spells that might be useful after 24 hours. I then wrote down which ones were unique to the wizard, shared between the wizard, cleric and/or druid, and then unique to cleric or druid. </p><p></p><p>I did it because over there I saw, yet again, the argument that this spell preparation thing doesn't bother the wizard when it comes from the cleric or druid because they have little overlap and those two classes have weaker spell lists for solving problems. I used only the PHB because... it was the closest book to me at the time. I could have missed a few spells, but I don't think that will matter in the long run.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Spells shared by Clerics, Druids, and Wizards that are utility spells (not including subclasses, but they should be included, for example, Knowledge cleric gets Identify).</p><p></p><p>[SPOILER="Spells Shared"]* Detect Magic</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Augury (just added via UA to wizard, yeah, I'm cheating)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Continual Flame</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Enhance Ability (added via UA to wizard)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Gentle Repose</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Locate Object</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Darkvision</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Enlarge/Reduce (added via UA to Druid)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Clairvoyance</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Dispel Magic</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Feign Death</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Glyph of Warding</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Magic Circle</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Protection from Energy</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Sending</li> </ul><p>*Speak with Dead (via UA to Wizard)</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Tongues</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Water Breathing</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Control Water</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Divination (via UA to Wizard)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Locate Creature</li> </ul><p>*Stone Shape</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Hallucinatory Terrain</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Polymorph</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Geas</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Legend Lore</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Planar Binding</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Scrying</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">True Seeing</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Move Earth</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Etherealness</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Plane Shift</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Symbol</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Antimagic Field</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Control Weather</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Astral Projection</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Gate</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Mirage Arcane</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Reverse Gravity</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Antipathy/Sympathy</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Foresight</li> </ul><p>[/SPOILER]</p><p></p><p></p><p>Spells unique to Cleric and Druid that are utility</p><p></p><p>[SPOILER="Spells Unique to Cleric and Druid"]* Create or Destroy Water</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Detect Evil and Good</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Detect Poison and Disease</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Goodberry</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Purify Food and Drink</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Calm Emotions</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Find Traps</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Protection from Poison</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Silence</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Zone of Truth</li> </ul><p>*Speak with Animals</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Animal Messenger</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Beast Sense</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Locate Animals or Plants</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Pass Without Trace</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Create Food and Water</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Meld Into Stone</li> </ul><p>*Water Walk</p><p>*Speak with Plants</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Commune</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Commmune With Nature</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Hallow</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Find the Path</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Forbiddance</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Heroes Feast</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Planar Ally</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Word of Recall</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Awaken</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Transport Via Plants</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Wind Walk</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Earthquake</li> </ul><p>[/SPOILER]</p><p></p><p>Spells unique to Wizard that are utility</p><p></p><p>[SPOILER="Spells Unique to Wizard"]* Alarm</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Comprehend Language</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Find Familiar</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Identify</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Illusory Script</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Tenser's Floating Disk</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Unseen Servant</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Alter Self</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Arcane Lock</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Detect Thoughts</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Knock</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Magic Mouth</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Nystul's MAgic Aura</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Rope Trick</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">See Invisibility</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Spider Climb (but I will point out Wildshape as well)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Suggestion</li> </ul><p>*Arcane Eye</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Fabricate</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Leomunds Secret Chest</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Mordenkainen's Private Sanctum</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Contact other Plane</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Bigby's Hand</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Creation</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Dream</li> </ul><p>*Modify Memory</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Passwall</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Rary's Telepathic Bond</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Telekinesis</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Teleportation Circle</li> </ul><p>*Teleportation</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Arcane Gate</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Contingency</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Drawjmi's Instant Summons</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Guards and Wards</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">MAgic Jar</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">MAss Suggesstion</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Programmed Illusion</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Project Image</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Sequester</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Simulacrum</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Clone</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Demiplane</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Mind Blank</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Telepathy</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Imprisonment</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Time Stop</li> </ul><p>*Wish[/SPOILER]</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>So, the tl;dr </p><p>Wizards, Clerics and Druids share 41 utility spells. </p><p>Clerics and Druids have 31 unique. </p><p>Wizards have 49 uniques. </p><p></p><p>Interestingly, most cleric and druid uniques come from low level spells, while wizards get lots of unique high level spells. </p><p></p><p>Finally, what do Sorcerers take that is unique to wizards, what is there overlap of spells they can use to solve problems that Spell versatility will take from the Wizard's book?</p><p></p><p>[SPOILER="The List"]* Comprehend Language</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Alter Self</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Detect Thoughts</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Knock</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">See Invisibility</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Spider Climb</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Suggestion</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Creation</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Telekinesis</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Teleportation Circle</li> </ul><p>*Teleportation</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Arcane Gate</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Mass Suggestion</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Demiplane (Added via UA)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Time Stop</li> </ul><p>*Wish[/SPOILER]</p><p></p><p>A mere 16 spells. </p><p></p><p>So, Clerics and Druids share 41 spells with wizards that are utility. Some of those are on the Sorcerer too, but definitely not all. And the spells that the Sorcerer takes that the Wizard might otherwise have used as their 1 spell, there are 16 of them. </p><p></p><p>Leaving, 33 spells still unique to the Wizard here</p><p></p><p></p><p>This is the massive overlap that Sorcerers have with Wizards in Utility spells, the one that Clerics and Druids are 'definetly not a part of', 16 spells that suddenly dethrone the wizard if the sorcerer can prepare them after a day's rest. </p><p></p><p></p><p>I think that really puts this discussion of sorcerers stealing the wizards spotlight into perspective. We can still argue thematics, but I think arguing that the sorcerer is now a better go to caster for solutions, even better than the cleric or druid, is false.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Chaosmancer, post: 7868090, member: 6801228"] Also, just as a data point. Last night over at GiTP I ended up doing some work. I went through the PHB and started listing all the Utility spells I could find. Spells that might be useful after 24 hours. I then wrote down which ones were unique to the wizard, shared between the wizard, cleric and/or druid, and then unique to cleric or druid. I did it because over there I saw, yet again, the argument that this spell preparation thing doesn't bother the wizard when it comes from the cleric or druid because they have little overlap and those two classes have weaker spell lists for solving problems. I used only the PHB because... it was the closest book to me at the time. I could have missed a few spells, but I don't think that will matter in the long run. Spells shared by Clerics, Druids, and Wizards that are utility spells (not including subclasses, but they should be included, for example, Knowledge cleric gets Identify). [SPOILER="Spells Shared"]* Detect Magic [LIST] [*]Augury (just added via UA to wizard, yeah, I'm cheating) [*]Continual Flame [*]Enhance Ability (added via UA to wizard) [*]Gentle Repose [*]Locate Object [*]Darkvision [*]Enlarge/Reduce (added via UA to Druid) [*]Clairvoyance [*]Dispel Magic [*]Feign Death [*]Glyph of Warding [*]Magic Circle [*]Protection from Energy [*]Sending [/LIST] *Speak with Dead (via UA to Wizard) [LIST] [*]Tongues [*]Water Breathing [*]Control Water [*]Divination (via UA to Wizard) [*]Locate Creature [/LIST] *Stone Shape [LIST] [*]Hallucinatory Terrain [*]Polymorph [*]Geas [*]Legend Lore [*]Planar Binding [*]Scrying [*]True Seeing [*]Move Earth [*]Etherealness [*]Plane Shift [*]Symbol [*]Antimagic Field [*]Control Weather [*]Astral Projection [*]Gate [*]Mirage Arcane [*]Reverse Gravity [*]Antipathy/Sympathy [*]Foresight [/LIST] [/SPOILER] Spells unique to Cleric and Druid that are utility [SPOILER="Spells Unique to Cleric and Druid"]* Create or Destroy Water [LIST] [*]Detect Evil and Good [*]Detect Poison and Disease [*]Goodberry [*]Purify Food and Drink [*]Calm Emotions [*]Find Traps [*]Protection from Poison [*]Silence [*]Zone of Truth [/LIST] *Speak with Animals [LIST] [*]Animal Messenger [*]Beast Sense [*]Locate Animals or Plants [*]Pass Without Trace [*]Create Food and Water [*]Meld Into Stone [/LIST] *Water Walk *Speak with Plants [LIST] [*]Commune [*]Commmune With Nature [*]Hallow [*]Find the Path [*]Forbiddance [*]Heroes Feast [*]Planar Ally [*]Word of Recall [*]Awaken [*]Transport Via Plants [*]Wind Walk [*]Earthquake [/LIST] [/SPOILER] Spells unique to Wizard that are utility [SPOILER="Spells Unique to Wizard"]* Alarm [LIST] [*]Comprehend Language [*]Find Familiar [*]Identify [*]Illusory Script [*]Tenser's Floating Disk [*]Unseen Servant [*]Alter Self [*]Arcane Lock [*]Detect Thoughts [*]Knock [*]Magic Mouth [*]Nystul's MAgic Aura [*]Rope Trick [*]See Invisibility [*]Spider Climb (but I will point out Wildshape as well) [*]Suggestion [/LIST] *Arcane Eye [LIST] [*]Fabricate [*]Leomunds Secret Chest [*]Mordenkainen's Private Sanctum [*]Contact other Plane [*]Bigby's Hand [*]Creation [*]Dream [/LIST] *Modify Memory [LIST] [*]Passwall [*]Rary's Telepathic Bond [*]Telekinesis [*]Teleportation Circle [/LIST] *Teleportation [LIST] [*]Arcane Gate [*]Contingency [*]Drawjmi's Instant Summons [*]Guards and Wards [*]MAgic Jar [*]MAss Suggesstion [*]Programmed Illusion [*]Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion [*]Project Image [*]Sequester [*]Simulacrum [*]Clone [*]Demiplane [*]Mind Blank [*]Telepathy [*]Imprisonment [*]Time Stop [/LIST] *Wish[/SPOILER] So, the tl;dr Wizards, Clerics and Druids share 41 utility spells. Clerics and Druids have 31 unique. Wizards have 49 uniques. Interestingly, most cleric and druid uniques come from low level spells, while wizards get lots of unique high level spells. Finally, what do Sorcerers take that is unique to wizards, what is there overlap of spells they can use to solve problems that Spell versatility will take from the Wizard's book? [SPOILER="The List"]* Comprehend Language [LIST] [*]Alter Self [*]Detect Thoughts [*]Knock [*]See Invisibility [*]Spider Climb [*]Suggestion [*]Creation [*]Telekinesis [*]Teleportation Circle [/LIST] *Teleportation [LIST] [*]Arcane Gate [*]Mass Suggestion [*]Demiplane (Added via UA) [*]Time Stop [/LIST] *Wish[/SPOILER] A mere 16 spells. So, Clerics and Druids share 41 spells with wizards that are utility. Some of those are on the Sorcerer too, but definitely not all. And the spells that the Sorcerer takes that the Wizard might otherwise have used as their 1 spell, there are 16 of them. Leaving, 33 spells still unique to the Wizard here This is the massive overlap that Sorcerers have with Wizards in Utility spells, the one that Clerics and Druids are 'definetly not a part of', 16 spells that suddenly dethrone the wizard if the sorcerer can prepare them after a day's rest. I think that really puts this discussion of sorcerers stealing the wizards spotlight into perspective. We can still argue thematics, but I think arguing that the sorcerer is now a better go to caster for solutions, even better than the cleric or druid, is false. [/QUOTE]
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