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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Tovec" data-source="post: 6321185" data-attributes="member: 95493">The toxicity isn't the mechanic itself. It is the way the mechanic is viewed. Sorry if that is unclear that is the nature of having to refer to DoaM in such a way. I'm not saying that DoaM is bad because it is unbalanced. It is bad because of the many considerations that weren't put into the mechanic. It doesn't interact with the game-world well. It doesn't (to me) have a consistent and good explanation of how it works. I don't care if it is the WEAKEST choice in the game, it bugs me all the same. It is toxic because it makes people not want to play the game. It is a weed because this poorly thought out idea might spread to other areas and be equally poorly thought out in their interactions and for how they work.Second wind has its own problems but there is a basis in the name for something that can happen. I have separate issues with it but that doesn't make DoaM a failed issue. Most of the problems I have with 5e stem from a poor definition of HP and AC. DoaM not only revels in the grey area it points at it and makes everyone stare. I find that distasteful because it is something I try NOT to think about it and this game exploits it. I can't even think of an example of something that would be similar to this and I usually have an example for everything. DoaM just bugs me. Second wind only interacts with HP, so it bugs me less in that way I think. Non-magical healing is an entirely different kettle of fish.I can understand from a lot of these threads that the feeling of niche protection or more specifically 'fighters can't have nice things' does come up a lot. I reiterate that I want them to have nice things, I just don't want those things to be magical. I am no more happy with wizards being able to heal and I feel there should be a clearer marking off of territory there. (Maybe giving clerics the debuffing, limiting wizards to controlling and explosions.) This goes beyond role. I can easily accept fighters being able to crowd control, except when Come and Get It tactics are employed. It is when the abilities displayed are not representative of the class I was promised. Warlocks make pacts to get more power? Cool. Warlocks can now suddenly rage out and turn into the Hulk. Why? Isn't that the barbarian schtick?I don't want the fighter's job to be carrying around the wizard's spellbooks or even for them to be solely good at one thing. I love highly customizable fighters. But I don't think this mechanic is very good or the way to go. I'm not even opposed to making/supernatural some fighters magical - a la paladin, ranger, monk? - in order to get new tricks accomplished. Even in those cases, while I expect a paladin to be great at combating evil, I expect the fighter to be the king of combat. Hell, give them back the Lordly title, lands, and servants. I'm all for that too. As I see it there are plenty of things that can be done with non-magical means in the non-magical fighter and I would like to see them explore that, over a mechanic that can never fail to miss.</blockquote>

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