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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Banshee16" data-source="post: 5451290" data-attributes="member: 7883">I forgot about the loss of limbs rules....those were great.I also liked the chain of Parry feats, Parry, Continuous Parry, Riposte, Sidestep, etc. etc.  They really made fencing/fighting a lot of fun.I've got a soft spot in my heart for those kinds of rules in D&D.  A setting with the trappings of high fantasy, but also including things like smokepowder weapons, wizards, dragons and other monsters etc could be a lot of fun.  The Spirosblaak setting had a lot of that, and was rather cool..but it was at the tail end of 3E, and I don't think a lot of people got to try it.I'm not sure if you can easily have the whole smoke powder + swashbucklers style in regular D&D/Pathfinder without really throwing off the feel.  It's hard to imagine barbarians with great axes fighting against a fighter with rapier and maingauche, and a brace of pistols.  I think that's where most of the disagreements in this thread are coming from.However, I can recognize what Paizo is trying to do.  They're trying to provide a ruleset that would allow this, but limit its standard implementation to a particular area of the game world, and make it up to the GM and players to determine if it'll ever go beyond there.What I think makes things more confusing, however, is that D&D has always been a mishmash of periods.  Many elements of the game harken to the Dark Ages, where plate armor wasn't even in use yet......I mean, into the 1100's and 1200's they were pretty much still running around in chainmail, weren't they?  Yet D&D has plate armor, which is more indicative of the 1200's and 1300's isn't it?  Yet firearms were in use in the late 1200's, and in widespread use in Europe by the 1300's, from what I understand.So in the periods that D&D seeks to emulate, firearms were already in use, yet people get hung up about it.If you don't want them in the game, don't use them.As to slowing reload times of crossbows, I'm not necessarily averse to that.  They're already listed as simple weapons, meaning the most number of possible characters can use them, vs. bows which are martial weapons.  Maybe give them similar penetrating rules as what the firearms are given.Now you've got firearms and crossbows both being readily available, for use by masses of troops, as opposed to highly trained archers, with lethal penetrating power through armor, yet very slow reload times.Give heavy crossbows a reload time of 10 rounds, light crossbows 8 rounds, and hand crossbows 6 rounds.  And include the feat that lets you halve the reload times.Firearms might keep the better critical multiplier.Now you have them as effective weapons that have both advantages and disadvantages.  And the firearms and crossbows statistically would be very similar....so there wouldn't be the concern about firearms overriding the game....yet they'd still be a viable option.Banshee</blockquote>

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