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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mustrum_Ridcully" data-source="post: 4462361" data-attributes="member: 710">I am not sure I get this cost comparison... <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f615.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":confused:" title="Confused    :confused:"  data-smilie="5"data-shortname=":confused:" />A "compromise" I can see is that taking the feat gives you the benefits of your unarmed strike being equivalent to a military weapon (+2 proficiency, 1d6 damage, off-hand property as a suggestion) and use it as a prerequisite for later feats that improve the strike. Of course, I am not sure if using a feat as a prerequisite is such a good idea in the first place. Certainly don't try to build an entire feat tree. Only someone really dedicated to fighting unarmed would take these, and these would rise the benefits to superior melee weapons.Combat Martial ArtsPrerequisite: Str13+, Dex13+Your unarmed strikes gain a +2 proficiency bonus and their damage increases by one die size (1d6 for medium size creatures) and gains the off-hand property.Cutting StrikePrerequisite: Dex13+, Combat Martial ArtsYour unarmed strike gain a +3 proficiency bonus and you can treat them as light blade or Axe if this is beneficial for you.Iron FistPrerequisite: Con 13+, Combat Martial ArtsYour unarmed strike damage increases by an additional die size (1d8 for medium size creatures) and you can treat them as hammer or mace if this is beneficial for you.Defensive Martial ArtsPrerequisite: Combat Martial Arts, Dex13+While fighting with cloth armor and no shield, you gain a +1 bonus to AC and Reflex Defense.Masterful Defensive Martial Arts (Paragon)Prerequisite: Defense Martial Arts, Dex15+While fighting with cloth armor and no shield, you gain a +1 bonus to AC and Reflex Defense. This stacks with the benefit of Defense Martial Arts.Exceptional Defensive Martial Arts (Epic)Prerequisite: Defense Martial Arts, Dex17+While fighting with cloth armor and no shield, you gain a +1 bonus to AC and Reflex Defense. This stacks with the benefit of Defense Martial Arts and Masterful Defensive Arts.Variant for the Defense Martial Arts: Increase the benefits to +2 and +3 for paragon and epic respectively, but don't allow stacking - this way, characters can retrain the old feat. I was also tempted to make the benefits dependent on the kind of armor you are proficient in - anyone trained with heavy armor might gain a +2 bonus instead of just +1.Maybe something like this: Defensive Martial Arts (Heroic, Retraining Feat*)Prerequisite: Combat Martial Arts, Dex 13+Benefit: You lose all armor and shield proficiency training except cloth.When wearing cloth armor and no shield, you gain a defensive bonus to AC and Reflex defense dependent on the armor you were proficient in: Cloth, Leather: +1Hide, Chain or Light Shield: +2Scale, Plate or Heavy Shield: +3Special: If you have or later take any feats that grant proficiency in armor or shields, they grant no benefit until you have retrained this feat for something else.I am not convinced this gives always "balanced" results. *) I am calling this out as a special keyword because the idea is that you retrain fundamental aspects of your character, like class abilities. Or that.Or that.<img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /></blockquote>

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