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Using Action Surge to cast spells in 2024
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<blockquote data-quote="James Gasik" data-source="post: 9756512" data-attributes="member: 6877472"><p>I think another section needs to be bolded here. Specifically: "<strong>When you take the Magic action, you cast a spell that has a casting time of an action</strong>...". </p><p></p><p>Now bear with me, because I want to go over every point carefully.</p><p></p><p>Let's assume this is a valid reading of the rules: <em>if the spell's casting time is other than "an action", it's not the Magic action</em>. We see this with shield and counterspell, naturally, but also with Warcaster and the War Magic feature of the Eldritch Knight.</p><p></p><p>Logically, casting a spell using your reaction via the Ready Action would work the same way, ie, we're not using the Magic Action. But then we have this pesky "cast the spell as normal" rule which doesn't define what "as normal" means in this instance. Is it "as normal" by the spellcasting rules? "As normal" for the person casting the spell? </p><p></p><p>The argument in play is that Ready turns the Magic Action into a Reaction, despite the fact the rules don't explicitly say this (the assumption is that it is implicit by the "as normal" wording). The rules for Readying a spell are even more murky, as they state you begin casting the spell, but the spell doesn't go off until you use your Reaction, and if your concentration is interrupted. The spell slot and components are consumed when you Ready the spell. </p><p></p><p>All well and good, but the original question has to do not with casting a spell, but a magic item, and this is where things get sticky:</p><p></p><p>"Some magic items allow the user to cast a spell from the item. The spell is cast at the lowest possible spell and caster level, doesn't expend any of the user's spell slots, and requires no components, unless the item's description says otherwise. The spell uses its normal casting time, range, and duration, and the user of the item must concentrate if the spell requires concentration."</p><p></p><p><strong>The Wand of Magic Missile</strong>: "This wand has 7 charges. While holding it, you can use an action to expend 1 or more of its charges to cast the <em>magic missile</em> spell from it. For 1 charge, you cast the 1st-level version of the spell. You can increase the spell slot level by one for each additional charge you expend."</p><p></p><p>With this item, the user isn't really casting the spell. The Wand is casting the spell when the user uses an action to expend one of its charges. Ok, following me so far? Here's where it gets weird.</p><p></p><p><a href="https://www.sageadvice.eu/is-readying-action-to-use-a-magic-item-the-same-as-readying-action-to-cast-spell/" target="_blank">It's time for another confusing Dev Tweet!</a></p><p></p><p><strong>Using a Wand does not use the spell rule in Ready!</strong></p><p></p><p>So what on Earth does that mean, exactly? Let's look at the rule again:</p><p></p><p>"When you <strong>ready a spell</strong>, you cast it as normal but hold its energy, which you release with your reaction when the trigger occurs. To be readied, a spell must have a casting time of 1 action, and holding onto the spell's magic <strong>requires concentration</strong>."</p><p></p><p>So, in summary, readying to use a Wand or Staff does not require concentration, does not use a spell slot, is not "cast normally". So what does this mean?</p><p></p><p>Some possibilities: you can't Ready a Wand or Staff! Hardly likely, but I had to mention it.</p><p></p><p>Alternately, you can Quicken a Spell that uses a Spell Slot, casting it with a Bonus Action, and still use the Magic Action to use a Wand/Staff, since charges =/= spell slots.</p><p></p><p>Or maybe Jeremy doesn't know what he's talking about, and spell slots = charges.</p><p></p><p>And finally, it's possible that if Readying a Wand/Staff is not "casting a spell as normal", then you're not using the Magic Action at all, even when using the extra action of Action Surge to Ready it!</p><p></p><p>(Insert Jeremy doesn't know what he's talking about again).</p><p></p><p>TLDR: went over rules, found dev tweet, nothing is explained. We're back to square one, making a ruling on (presumed) designer intent when the designer intent is not made obvious.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="James Gasik, post: 9756512, member: 6877472"] I think another section needs to be bolded here. Specifically: "[B]When you take the Magic action, you cast a spell that has a casting time of an action[/B]...". Now bear with me, because I want to go over every point carefully. Let's assume this is a valid reading of the rules: [I]if the spell's casting time is other than "an action", it's not the Magic action[/I]. We see this with shield and counterspell, naturally, but also with Warcaster and the War Magic feature of the Eldritch Knight. Logically, casting a spell using your reaction via the Ready Action would work the same way, ie, we're not using the Magic Action. But then we have this pesky "cast the spell as normal" rule which doesn't define what "as normal" means in this instance. Is it "as normal" by the spellcasting rules? "As normal" for the person casting the spell? The argument in play is that Ready turns the Magic Action into a Reaction, despite the fact the rules don't explicitly say this (the assumption is that it is implicit by the "as normal" wording). The rules for Readying a spell are even more murky, as they state you begin casting the spell, but the spell doesn't go off until you use your Reaction, and if your concentration is interrupted. The spell slot and components are consumed when you Ready the spell. All well and good, but the original question has to do not with casting a spell, but a magic item, and this is where things get sticky: "Some magic items allow the user to cast a spell from the item. The spell is cast at the lowest possible spell and caster level, doesn't expend any of the user's spell slots, and requires no components, unless the item's description says otherwise. The spell uses its normal casting time, range, and duration, and the user of the item must concentrate if the spell requires concentration." [B]The Wand of Magic Missile[/B]: "This wand has 7 charges. While holding it, you can use an action to expend 1 or more of its charges to cast the [I]magic missile[/I] spell from it. For 1 charge, you cast the 1st-level version of the spell. You can increase the spell slot level by one for each additional charge you expend." With this item, the user isn't really casting the spell. The Wand is casting the spell when the user uses an action to expend one of its charges. Ok, following me so far? Here's where it gets weird. [URL='https://www.sageadvice.eu/is-readying-action-to-use-a-magic-item-the-same-as-readying-action-to-cast-spell/']It's time for another confusing Dev Tweet![/URL] [B]Using a Wand does not use the spell rule in Ready![/B] So what on Earth does that mean, exactly? Let's look at the rule again: "When you [B]ready a spell[/B], you cast it as normal but hold its energy, which you release with your reaction when the trigger occurs. To be readied, a spell must have a casting time of 1 action, and holding onto the spell's magic [B]requires concentration[/B]." So, in summary, readying to use a Wand or Staff does not require concentration, does not use a spell slot, is not "cast normally". So what does this mean? Some possibilities: you can't Ready a Wand or Staff! Hardly likely, but I had to mention it. Alternately, you can Quicken a Spell that uses a Spell Slot, casting it with a Bonus Action, and still use the Magic Action to use a Wand/Staff, since charges =/= spell slots. Or maybe Jeremy doesn't know what he's talking about, and spell slots = charges. And finally, it's possible that if Readying a Wand/Staff is not "casting a spell as normal", then you're not using the Magic Action at all, even when using the extra action of Action Surge to Ready it! (Insert Jeremy doesn't know what he's talking about again). TLDR: went over rules, found dev tweet, nothing is explained. We're back to square one, making a ruling on (presumed) designer intent when the designer intent is not made obvious. [/QUOTE]
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