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<blockquote data-quote="jgsugden" data-source="post: 9674716" data-attributes="member: 2629">Generally agreed with your conclusion, but I don't agree that the game is not designed for 20 ability scores as early as level 1.&nbsp; Random generation is allowed and there is over a 1 in 3 chance of one or more PCs rolling an 18 in a 5 PC party at first level (that can be bumped straight to 20).&nbsp; Honestly, they have to expect cheats, so they have to expect the number will end up being (much?) higher than 1 in 3.&nbsp; They had to consider level 1 20s a reasonable possibility in design. And they did.&nbsp; While a PC is strong, a primary stat between 14 and 20 is perfectly fine in D&amp;D if you follow the guidelines.&nbsp; As a more general comment on ability scores:In 2014 one of my first PCs was a Fighter Archer that rolled an 18 Dexterity (bumped to 20) and had the Archery Fighting style.&nbsp; This gave him a +9 to attack for 1d8+5.&nbsp; It was not definitely strong - but was a I dealing more damage when I hit than a barbarian?&nbsp; No.&nbsp; Was my AC of 18 ridiculously high?&nbsp; Not ridiculously.&nbsp; It was a very effective PC, but not outside the bounds of the game ... and with the rebalancing of the game to make monsters tougher, I'd say it would be less problematic today than in 2014, although I have not had enough experience to draw upon in 2024 to be sure.In the end, to me, people misunderstand what the impacts of a high ability score and higher efficiency for a PC do for the game.&nbsp; The primary impact is not that they deal 7.54325345% more damage per round - the primary difference is how they feel in game and how the story revolves differently around their PC.&nbsp; A 20 stated PC gets the starring role that is expected to win the game ... which can make they Superman, or Gaston from Beauty and the Beast.&nbsp; A 14 stated PC is the everyman character that isn't the best at anything, but they have a chance to be the underdog character that saves the day.&nbsp; Both character models have countless tales that would be a lot of fun to emulate or evolve as a PC.&nbsp; If my last PC had high stats or was uber-efficient, my next PC will tend to be less efficient just for a change of pace.&nbsp; This used to take the form of choosing a less powerful class (in AD&amp;D I often alternated between cleric and other classes as I found the weaknesses and limitations of the cleric to be good story fodder).&nbsp; In more recent editions it often meant selecting suboptimal subclasses like 4 Elements, Champion, and Beast Master.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="jgsugden, post: 9674716, member: 2629"] Generally agreed with your conclusion, but I don't agree that the game is not designed for 20 ability scores as early as level 1. Random generation is allowed and there is over a 1 in 3 chance of one or more PCs rolling an 18 in a 5 PC party at first level (that can be bumped straight to 20). Honestly, they have to expect cheats, so they have to expect the number will end up being (much?) higher than 1 in 3. They had to consider level 1 20s a reasonable possibility in design. And they did. While a PC is strong, a primary stat between 14 and 20 is perfectly fine in D&D if you follow the guidelines. As a more general comment on ability scores: In 2014 one of my first PCs was a Fighter Archer that rolled an 18 Dexterity (bumped to 20) and had the Archery Fighting style. This gave him a +9 to attack for 1d8+5. It was not definitely strong - but was a I dealing more damage when I hit than a barbarian? No. Was my AC of 18 ridiculously high? Not ridiculously. It was a very effective PC, but not outside the bounds of the game ... and with the rebalancing of the game to make monsters tougher, I'd say it would be less problematic today than in 2014, although I have not had enough experience to draw upon in 2024 to be sure. In the end, to me, people misunderstand what the impacts of a high ability score and higher efficiency for a PC do for the game. The primary impact is not that they deal 7.54325345% more damage per round - the primary difference is how they feel in game and how the story revolves differently around their PC. A 20 stated PC gets the starring role that is expected to win the game ... which can make they Superman, or Gaston from Beauty and the Beast. A 14 stated PC is the everyman character that isn't the best at anything, but they have a chance to be the underdog character that saves the day. Both character models have countless tales that would be a lot of fun to emulate or evolve as a PC. If my last PC had high stats or was uber-efficient, my next PC will tend to be less efficient just for a change of pace. This used to take the form of choosing a less powerful class (in AD&D I often alternated between cleric and other classes as I found the weaknesses and limitations of the cleric to be good story fodder). In more recent editions it often meant selecting suboptimal subclasses like 4 Elements, Champion, and Beast Master. [/QUOTE]

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