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<blockquote data-quote="Maxperson" data-source="post: 8475845" data-attributes="member: 23751">It is uncertain ONLY when there is a very specific mechanic that contradicts or creates an ex exception to the player decides rule.This is false.&nbsp; There's nothing arbitrary about it. The exclusion is based purely on reason and rules.&nbsp; Since exclusion =/= inclusion, every social rule example deals entirely with NPCs and there are no social specific contradictions or exceptions to the player decides rule, we can reason that social skills are excluded.&nbsp; This is backed up by RAI being to exclude them as we surmised.Again, reason is literally the opposite of arbitrary.&nbsp; It doesn't matter if the NPC passes off a disguise.&nbsp; Nothing about a disguise prevents the player from deciding.&nbsp; He can be suspicious of the NPC or not as the player decides.There is no such rule.&nbsp; The rule is that the DM calls for a check if the outcome is in doubt.&nbsp; This does not contradict or create an exception to the rule that the player decides.&nbsp; If the player decides yes or no, the outcome is not in doubt and the DM rule never comes into play.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Maxperson, post: 8475845, member: 23751"] It is uncertain ONLY when there is a very specific mechanic that contradicts or creates an ex exception to the player decides rule. This is false. There's nothing arbitrary about it. The exclusion is based purely on reason and rules. Since exclusion =/= inclusion, every social rule example deals entirely with NPCs and there are no social specific contradictions or exceptions to the player decides rule, we can reason that social skills are excluded. This is backed up by RAI being to exclude them as we surmised. Again, reason is literally the opposite of arbitrary. It doesn't matter if the NPC passes off a disguise. Nothing about a disguise prevents the player from deciding. He can be suspicious of the NPC or not as the player decides. There is no such rule. The rule is that [B]the DM calls for a check if the outcome is in doubt[/B]. This does not contradict or create an exception to the rule that the player decides. If the player decides yes or no, the outcome is not in doubt and the DM rule never comes into play. [/QUOTE]

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